Staggered vs Square

[ETAction]

Hey guys,

Purchasing new wheels and am considering going square, increase practicality, warranty issues for rotation, and drive-ability ease.

squared: wheel 18x8.5 tire 235/245

Staggered is keeping the factory setup in mind and who doesn't like a nice wide tire in the rear, performance fun as well as nice looking.

staggered: 18x8.5 front 18x9 rear. tire - 235/45 and 255/40


Feel free to comment on the sizing stuff (input appreciated) but what I'm really after is the staggered vs square setup.

Who is for staggered and who is for squared? por que?

[az3579]

Squared. More pros than with a staggered setup.

More neutral handling, can rotate tires (if they're not directional), and IMO looks better having all four the same size. Also, tire warranty may be longer with certain brands.

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[ELCID86]

Square with rear spacers. (LMK if you'd like to buy a set (or two!) ;))

[ZHPizza]

Square square square

Staggered is good for looks, but these cars are so much more fun with the neutral handling of a square setup

[san]

I went with square. 245/40 on 17x8.5. I drive about 20k miles a year so I wanted to able to rotate the tires. When I had OEM staggered, the rears wore twice as fast as the fronts.


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[ETAction]

Alright, squared is declared. Thanks guys

235/40....? What are the advantages of 235/45..? More cushion for the pushin'....??

[san]

I (actually Daniel, cause I got them used from him) went with 245/40 cause that’s the closest to OEM diameter I think.


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[ETAction]

so now its 235/40 vs 245/40....

my indecisiveness will be the death of me.....

[san]

Maybe this might help -

APEX ARC-8 Fitment Thread
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?share_fid=14392&share_tid=21416&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Ezhpmafia%2Ecom%2Fforums%2Fs howthread%2Ephp%3Ft%3D21416&share_type=t

And

Apex ARC8 17" vs. 18", Offset, and Tire Size Questions
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?share_fid=14392&share_tid=16922&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Ezhpmafia%2Ecom%2Fforums%2Fs howthread%2Ephp%3Ft%3D16922&share_type=t

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[ETAction]

That was great. Thanks San

Appreciate the assist

[ZHPizza]

235/40 is a little larger than OE 255/35 diameter. 245 puts you in a weird place where a 40 series would be way too large, and a 35 series would be undersized a bit. I like how the 235/40 fills the wheel well a little better and may try to fit 245/40 down the road, but I'm already fighting some rubbing so...

Here's a calculator that I use

http://www.rimsntires.com/specspro.jsp

Edit: I searched around a bit and it looks like some people have run 245/40r18 without issue, so I'll definitely be looking into that for my next set of tires

[Reasoned1]

I have 245/40R18 PSS' on my ZHP with original springs, and I have no issues. It looks about an inch below the fender. The tire is closest to the strut spring seat--about 1/4".

[ZHPizza]

I have 245/40R18 PSS' on my ZHP with original springs, and I have no issues. It lookes about an inch below the fender. The tire is closest to the strut spring seat--about 1/4".

That's good to know. I just installed a 3.38 diff in the car yesterday and it's too many rpm for me at 80mph, but I can't give up that fresh new torque, so a taller tire will drop the highway revs by 40-50 and fit my fat ass wheels better :thumbup

[Reasoned1]

My speedo is spot on with those tires, and I love the ride (the roads around here demand a little extra cushion). I, too, have the 3.38, and it's still torquey. Plus it fills out the wheel well that much more.

[ZHPizza]

My speedo is spot on with those tires, and I love the ride (the roads around here demand a little extra cushion). I, too, have the 3.38, and it's still torquey. Plus it fills out the wheel well that much more.Got any profile shots of the car with the taller tires?

[danewilson77]

I'm on 245/40 w/ 10mm spacer in rear.

I think the wheels are 18x8 ET45

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[johnrando]

Square. I run 245/35 which a lot of people do. Mine are 18x8.5. Thinking of putting in small spacer in rear w my Apex EC-7 at ET 35.

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[Reasoned1]

Got any profile shots of the car with the taller tires?

Here you go (sans any spacers--the rears could use one, but I'm not willing to complicate matters)...

33233

33234

[webster]

i like the OEM staggered fitment but it appears i'm in the minority.

[johnrando]

Staggered is there to promote understeer which is there to make it easier for the avg driver to control the car. Of course it's to the driver's preference as to what they are looking for.

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[ETAction]

Ride stance and profile with new Michelin Pilot Sport 4S at 245/40 all the way around

Not quite stock height due to installment of new H&R sport springs but it's not much lower.

[Reasoned1]

SWEEEEET! Any spacers?

[ETAction]

SWEEEEET! Any spacers?

no spacers as of yet. I'll determine that need when I receive the car. Most likely will throw some in the rear....

[BMWCurves]

Staggered is there to promote understeer which is there to make it easier for the avg driver to control the car. Of course it's to the driver's preference as to what they are looking for.

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http://i.imgur.com/6ZMpxUm.png

[TKZHP]

I have a coupe. When i bought it, previous owner had square setup (225 and 8in rim all around). I threw on some 235 all around and drove it like that for 4 years. A couple months ago I tracked down an original staggered setup, and TBH I much prefer the staggered. Yes the square setup was more neutral, even had a bit of oversteer, but it was also more prone to wandering on the highway. I have a 3.38 diff and found the rears would break loose easily (obviously not an issue if u do 255 all around). I can see the square beinng a benefit for tire rotation and for autocrossing, but having run both swtups, id choose staggered for its looks and overall stability. Considering much more powerful cars than ours (like the m3) still run 225 in the front, maybe we shuld consider throwing more rubber in the front may cause more issues than it solves (unless u never drive on a highway and ur commute is an autocross course)

[ELCID86]

I just listed 2 sets of 12mm spacers for sale if anyone is (or wants to run square) and have a little extra width in the rear.

[ETAction]

Square. I run 245/35 which a lot of people do. Mine are 18x8.5. Thinking of putting in small spacer in rear w my Apex EC-7 at ET 38.

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What PSI are you running in the tires with this square setup?

[Reasoned1]

I usually run 34 pounds all around--I love the square set-up. The staggered set-up does seem more stable, but the square set-up with 245's is more dynamic and fun to me--with all the other practical benefits.

[johnrando]

I do 38 all around but I don't have any magical reason why.

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[BMWCurves]

I do 38 all around but I don't have any magical reason why.

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+1

[san]

I have 34psi on my 245/40 square. I tried 38psi but it was too harsh for MI roads.


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[Reasoned1]

I've read accounts of members having to use 34psi or less for more even tread wear, That's why I started, and I like the handling.

[d-rod]

Ok I’m about to switch over to a square setup and deciding on tire size. I’m looking for some comfort and stability. From what I read on here 245/40 is a good option, but a staggered setup will offer better stability ?


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[nsk040]

What do you mean by stability? Adding front tire by going square will dial-out some of the factory understeer so that would create instability using your definition.

[d-rod]

What do you mean by stability? Adding front tire by going square will dial-out some of the factory understeer so that would create instability using your definition.

I was referencing what was written by this member.


I have a coupe. When i bought it, previous owner had square setup (225 and 8in rim all around). I threw on some 235 all around and drove it like that for 4 years. A couple months ago I tracked down an original staggered setup, and TBH I much prefer the staggered. Yes the square setup was more neutral, even had a bit of oversteer, but it was also more prone to wandering on the highway. I have a 3.38 diff and found the rears would break loose easily (obviously not an issue if u do 255 all around). I can see the square beinng a benefit for tire rotation and for autocrossing, but having run both swtups, id choose staggered for its looks and overall stability. Considering much more powerful cars than ours (like the m3) still run 225 in the front, maybe we shuld consider throwing more rubber in the front may cause more issues than it solves (unless u never drive on a highway and ur commute is an autocross course)

I'm going with a square setup and after reading this informative article https://motoiq.com/how-to-properly-select-and-size-tires-for-performance/4/
the best tire choice for my new square setup (apex arc8 18x8.5) is 235 40 18

[Newjack]

I was referencing what was written by this member.



I'm going with a square setup and after reading this informative article https://motoiq.com/how-to-properly-select-and-size-tires-for-performance/4/
the best tire choice for my new square setup (apex arc8 18x8.5) is 235 40 18

Square setup on the ZHP is life. This was without question my favorite upgrade I did on my car.

[d-rod]

Square setup on the ZHP is life. This was without question my favorite upgrade I did on my car.

What tire size are you running on yours?

I’m probably going with the new Michelin PS4S


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[Newjack]

Apex Arc-8’s 17x8.5 Square – Michelin Pilot Super Sports 245/40/17

The Derbo special.