Summer tire with good tread wear

[gr330zhp]

Hey everyone

So I am looking to get 2 new rear summer tires for my 18s for the 740i. The car is on Michelin Pilot SS now. Though I love Michelin, (only tire I buy for the ZHP) Owning 2 rear wheel drive bmws on Michelin Pilot Sports will be expensive, especially the 7, which loves to eat rubber. I have had Pirellis, Dunlops, Yokos and Toyos on other Bmws and always go back to michelin. So anyway, I am looking for a tire that has a little bit better tread wear rating and still a high performance summer tire. I have fairly new michelin on the front which will stay.

Stock size is 255/45/18 for the rear and 235/50/18 for the front, but the rear wheel is 9.5" wide so looking to go 265 or 275.

What do you guys say?


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[M0nk3y]

Ever consider Hankook Venus V12s?

[Vas]

Hankook ventus v12 gets my vote.

[gr330zhp]

Guess I should look into Hankooks? Haha. Any other suggestions?


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[328ioc]

I don't own a set......yet.......but alot and I mean alot of people in Florida run the V12's.

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[danewilson77]

I ran the V12's and almost got 30k outta them.

[Vas]

I ran the V12's and almost got 30k outta them.

You actually owned a pair of summer tires?

Why not go back to them?

[Hermes]

I'm running the PSS' on the ZHP...

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c288/jhermes/B8802FF7-A671-4BDC-8B0E-1A7D04F051F8-10098-00000CEECBFCB8AD.jpg

Don't get the V12's... the $100 price difference for a set of 2 at that size isn't worth the quality difference. You might want to look into the new Hankook Ventus S1 noble2 or some Bridgestone Potenza RE760 Sports

[zhpnsnv]

Continental DW has decent tread wear and are very comfortable. Definitely a notch below PSS performance wise.

[M0nk3y]

In all reality, are you going to push the tire or just go back and forth?


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[Mike V]

+1 on Hankook Ventus V12 Evos. I really like them for street use. I was a big Kumho fan for 10+ years, but the XS is awful. Hankook is my new favorite cheap street tire. For my next set, I might quit being a cheapass and try a set of PSSs.

[M0nk3y]

+1 on Hankook Ventus V12 Evos. I really like them for street use. I was a big Kumho fan for 10+ years, but the XS is awful. Hankook is my new favorite cheap street tire. For my next set, I might quit being a cheapass and try a set of PSSs.

Or try the Dunlop Z2s. Awesome high performance summer tire that will out perform the PSS any day of the week

[gr330zhp]

In all reality, are you going to push the tire or just go back and forth?


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The car is driven spiritedly on long back roads all the time. I am not going to the track with it though.

[Rovert]

Ventus seem to be quite popular. I'm on my 3rd season using Continental DW's after the winters come off. I have probably put about 20K miles on those tires and they perform awesome. When i put my DW's to 95% of their grip passengers have long said a four letter word to describe the handling. LOL. The tread looks similar to the pilot sport so they are very quiet.

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[Hermes]

Or try the Dunlop Z2s. Awesome high performance summer tire that will out perform the PSS any day of the week

but those are $20 more than the Super Sports each, I thought he was trying to find a good tire but still spend a bit less

[gr330zhp]

but those are $20 more than the Super Sports each, I thought he was trying to find a good tire but still spend a bit less

Yeah. This is exactly what I am looking for.

And V12s are quite a bit cheaper. Will look into them more.

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[M0nk3y]

but those are $20 more than the Super Sports each, I thought he was trying to find a good tire but still spend a bit less

Gotcha. I didn't realize the prices for PSS. I was thinking of PS2s for some odd reason


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[kpro]

The hankook V12's are not a bad tire for the price and like your 7 my X5 eats tires. Im in the auto industry and sell many different types of tires and I second Dane's comment about about the Hankook's. Another good one is the Continental DWS, cheap and wear excellent on the BMW's, I've already gotten 18k out of the ones on my truck and they still have 8/32ns of tread and come with a 1 yr road hazard warranty from Continental. Hankook V12's would be my first recommendation and I've used them on multiple cars. I would tell you about Michelins but looks like you already know, tho I liked the Michelins on my X5, they are 315's in the rear they don't last more than 15k miles and for the money its just not worth it. Try the hankooks, I really don't think you'll be dissapointed.

[Hermes]

Carl said that if he was to run the staggered set on his wife's 750iL, he would just buy the PSS' and call it a day. He said the newest version of the 265's apparently has amazing lifespan despite the high performance nature of the tire. He's currently running the rare OE 16's from the V12, so he has a hard time finding quality tires in that size and wishes there was a PSS that fit those wheels.

[M0nk3y]

Tires get chewed up on SUVs and all other cars because of the toe setting. BMW loves to run massive toe in.

I run -1/16th of an inch and have been wearing perfectly fine (about 20k miles on my DD tires nearing replacement after this season - Toyo T1Rs). IIRC Toe setting on my car wants like -1/8th or 3/16th

[quikryptonite]

I'll throw in my two cents.
I love my Bridgestone RE760's. Tread rating is higher than a lot of other summer tires.

RE760 (http://www.tirebuyer.com/tires/bridgestone/potenza-re760-sport/p/style/35847)

I plan on buying another set when these wear out.

[JupiterBMW]

I'll throw another vote in for the Yoko S Drives... I seem to be the only one on here that likes them, but I think you'd here ally impressed. The biggest thing with them is the rubber compound is consistent for the life of the tires. Unlike Kumhos and Bridgestones, these tires won't lose their grip once the life is 50% or less.

Just a thought. V12 and these are similar in price, both much less than the PSS.

[derbo]

I'm a fan of the PSS. I think the Continental DW will be a good replacement for them if you are looking for a tire that last longer.

[SoarinZHP]

I just went through a pair of 760's... I got 40k out of them... For the most part I liked them. Wet traction was surprisingly strong. Dry traction was good. They were pretty quiet, too. The only drawback for me was when they began reaching the end of their life, they started feeling 'greasy' for lack of a better term...

[gr330zhp]

Ended up going with 2 Continental ExtremeContact DW in OE size, 255/45/18. Figured Id leave room in case I lower it :)


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[Hermes]

good choice, that's what I used to run on my E32

[Johal E32]

Hankook V12's are solid, as well as Bridgestone RE-760.

I ran them both on the E32 and on the old E39. I like them a lot.

The old old E39 had some sort of Sumitomo summer tires that was pretty good as well. HTRZ III? or something like that..

[Hermes]

I'm thinking of buying a set of Sumitomo HTR Z II for the 17" staggered M-Contours only because I can burn through 4 sets before it costs as much as 1 set of 18" PSS' on the ZHP :)

[terraphantm]

If you don't mind a slightly expensive tire, Pilot Supersports. I got just over 16k on the rears w/ the M3... and that's about twice what I usually get. My fronts barely look worn (still had 7/32" last I checked). The performance is simply awesome too.

[gr330zhp]

If you don't mind a slightly expensive tire, Pilot Supersports. I got just over 16k on the rears w/ the M3... and that's about twice what I usually get. My fronts barely look worn (still had 7/32" last I checked). The performance is simply awesome too.

Lol did you read the first post?


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[Jon D]

I ran a set of Nitto Invo's on the ZHP got about 20k out of them. Over all good reviews very predictable etc. switched to Pilot Super Sports this time and they are better. But the Nittos were less expensive by a fair bit.


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[Mike V]

I'm thinking of buying a set of Sumitomo HTR Z II for the 17" staggered M-Contours only because I can burn through 4 sets before it costs as much as 1 set of 18" PSS' on the ZHP :)

I bought a car a few years ago that had HTR ZII's on it. Those tires are terrible. They squeal like pigs when you're trying to have fun on curvy roads, and they were terrible in the rain. I hated those tires so much that I replaced them when they still had half their tread remaining. The HTR Z IIIs are much better, but I still prefer V12s.

[gr330zhp]

Okay, so those of you in snow regions, when are you throwing your summer wheels on? Im getting so antsy, and I think winter is pretty much done here, or at least that's what I keep telling myself. Haha


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[Rovert]

When temperatures that I drive in are consistently 8C/46F or higher. :)

[M0nk3y]

Okay, so those of you in snow regions, when are you throwing your summer wheels on? Im getting so antsy, and I think winter is pretty much done here, or at least that's what I keep telling myself. Haha


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Most tires it is usually 50F+

I had to pick my E82 up in 27F weather. The tires did not like it what so ever. Could not put any throttle down over cruising speed or else I'd break the rear loose. It was fun but it was a good reminder that summer tires should not see that weather

[Mike V]

I keep an eye on the forecast. If the weather looks decent for 7 days straight, I make the switch which is usually around late March. I did it too quick this year. I removed the winters from the X5 a couple weeks ago and it snowed 6" yesterday. Oops.

[quikryptonite]

Okay, so those of you in snow regions, when are you throwing your summer wheels on? Im getting so antsy, and I think winter is pretty much done here, or at least that's what I keep telling myself. Haha


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I am so ready to be done with winter, but here in Utah, we always seem to get one snowstorm in April... I do have the E30 though on all-seasons... I really want to get the summer rubber back on too. I have spring fever in the worst way. It was 68 degrees last Saturday and then it snowed three days in a row last week.

[az3579]

I put my summer tires back on last Friday. I got sick of the really loud noise the Pirelli Sottozero's make. I have Hankook Ventus V12 Evo K110 tires and have to say I am sold. My next set off daily driving tires will be these again.


If you don't mind a slightly expensive tire, Pilot Supersports. I got just over 16k on the rears w/ the M3... and that's about twice what I usually get. My fronts barely look worn (still had 7/32" last I checked). The performance is simply awesome too.

I think there are tires that have much better performance per dollar. The Pilot Sport and Super Sport tires are freaking awesome in performance, but are probably the worst value for money. 16k miles - do you drive on a track all day every day or are you chill on the road?

It is my opinion that tires that perform almost as good for around $200/per are probably a better buy based on your wear report.

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[gr330zhp]

Just put my summer wheels/tires on...so lets see how the Contis perform


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[Hermes]

Just put my summer wheels/tires on...so lets see how the Contis perform


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in for update as the car I'm looking at has some W rated Pilots that I'll likely be changing out

[gr330zhp]

Will keep you posted!


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[johnrando]

in for update as the car I'm looking at has some W rated Pilots that I'll likely be changing out

You no like pilots, or is it the W rating you no like?

[zhpnsnv]

I desperately want to put my summers back on this week despite the fact that they're run flats. I'm just so sick of these skinny winters. Made a big mistake and went 205 in the rear. Car has too much torque for that.

[sketchyd]

Thanks for the recs guys. Pulled the trigger on some re760s today for my new summer rims.

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[LivesNearCostco]

My front RE760's are wearing on the wear bars and I was thinking they didn't last that long. Couldn't find all the purchase and installation receipts, but looking through my maintenance records, I think they are the same pair installed December 2010, meaning they lasted almost 22,000 miles. If I remember correctly, the last set of rear RE760s lasted 19,860 miles. The current rears have 13,200 miles on them and at least 1/3rd the tread remaining. In any case, wearing better than I remember.

For my new fronts, debating amongst these (prices do not include tax or installation)
Bridgestone RE760 again, no warranty, $169
Potenza S-04 Pole Position, no warranty, $210
Potenza RE-050, no warranty, $228
Michelin PSS, 30K mile warranty, $215
Michelin PS3, 20K mile warranty, $252
bfG G-Force Sport comp 2, $164

Or I could go with all season--Bridgestone RE-970 or Michelin PS A/S, about $210 each--since I have the dedicated track wheels.

[danewilson77]

Tire warranties are only applicable to non Staggered setups?

:dunno

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[Hermes]

You no like pilots, or is it the W rating you no like?

I only buy Pilots that are Z rated

[johnrando]

That's what I thought professor. :)

[LivesNearCostco]

Dane, not sure. Read somewhere last night (maybe Tire Rack web site?) that a certain tire's mileage warranty was cut in half if not rotated, i.e. staggered setup. Costco normally requires regular rotation to honor treadwear warranties, but not sure how they handle cars with staggered setups.

I have thought about buying some APEX 17x9 rims for track/AutoX, turning my 17x8.5 D-force rims into the daily drivers, and selling the OEM 135s. Then I'd be square all the time.


Tire warranties are only applicable to non Staggered setups?

:dunno

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[KevinC]

Who even rotates their tires? Both my cars are staggered nowadays so it's irrelevant to me, but back when I had square setups, I RARELY rotated, and my tire wear was always fine. Proper balance and alignment seems much more critical.

[Mtnman]

Dane, not sure. Read somewhere last night (maybe Tire Rack web site?) that a certain tire's mileage warranty was cut in half if not rotated

I know as of last year, this is true with both mich pilot as plus and continental dws. The warranty went in half for non rotation

[johnrando]

Who even rotates their tires? Both my cars are staggered nowadays so it's irrelevant to me, but back when I had square setups, I RARELY rotated, and my tire wear was always fine. Proper balance and alignment seems much more critical.

That might be true, but technically you'd get longer life rotating. Especially with some of the tires we run costing so much.

[az3579]

The benefit of rotating isn't enough to make it worth my while to go through the effort. :dunno

Not rotating most definitely doesn't cut HALF the life of the tire. Maybe a couple of thousand miles at best. This statement applies to ZHPs of course. Most of our tires don't really last beyond 40k miles due top the high performance nature of our cars. Plus, a lot of the tires for our cars are directional AND staggered, so you can't rotate them if you wanted to.

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[zhpnsnv]

My front RE760's are wearing on the wear bars and I was thinking they didn't last that long. Couldn't find all the purchase and installation receipts, but looking through my maintenance records, I think they are the same pair installed December 2010, meaning they lasted almost 22,000 miles. If I remember correctly, the last set of rear RE760s lasted 19,860 miles. The current rears have 13,200 miles on them and at least 1/3rd the tread remaining. In any case, wearing better than I remember.

For my new fronts, debating amongst these (prices do not include tax or installation)
Bridgestone RE760 again, no warranty, $169
Potenza S-04 Pole Position, no warranty, $210
Potenza RE-050, no warranty, $228
Michelin PSS, 30K mile warranty, $215
Michelin PS3, 20K mile warranty, $252
bfG G-Force Sport comp 2, $164

Or I could go with all season--Bridgestone RE-970 or Michelin PS A/S, about $210 each--since I have the dedicated track wheels.

No foreseeable problems with mixing compounds and having more worn tires on the rear? I'd imagine that could get dicey in the rain.

[danewilson77]

Who even rotates their tires? Both my cars are staggered nowadays so it's irrelevant to me, but back when I had square setups, I RARELY rotated, and my tire wear was always fine. Proper balance and alignment seems much more critical.

I rotate my tires pretty religiously.

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[sketchyd]

No foreseeable problems with mixing compounds and having more worn tires on the rear? I'd imagine that could get dicey in the rain.

Typically as long as the compound is the same on an axle there aren't major issues. But true on the rain point if you aren't used to how your axles will react differently with different tires.

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[zhpnsnv]

Typically as long as the compound is the same on an axle there aren't major issues. But true on the rain point if you aren't used to how your axles will react differently with different tires.

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Yea I would not recommend different comps axle to axle to someone who doesn't practice car control.

[sketchyd]

Yea I would not recommend different comps axle to axle to someone who doesn't practice car control.

At lest not to someone with cars like ours. On say, a minivan though? Not likely to come in to play significantly.

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[quikryptonite]

I think this is the last summer on my tires life expectancy. Is the end of the summer a good time to buy summer tires? Do retailers drop the price to get rid of them, or if I find a good deal now should I just grab them?

[NorCalZman]

I think this is the last summer on my tires life expectancy. Is the end of the summer a good time to buy summer tires? Do retailers drop the price to get rid of them, or if I find a good deal now should I just grab them?

I saw in a banner ad on this site that Michelin is offering 70 bucks off on a set of their tires. Might want to click it and check out their deals.

[LivesNearCostco]

I do practice car control often! Whether I'm any good at it can be debated :santa2
I put two new Michelin Pilot Super Sports on the front, still on the RE-760 rear, which are just at the wear bars now. So far handles fine but I never push the car hard like that and haven't seen any rain since then. Once rears wear out, will replace with PSS also, maybe use those as rain tires for AutoX and track days.

Here's what the fronts looked like just before replacement. Inside edges had corded from extra negative camber. Had them flipped to get an extra 2 months life.
9565



Yea I would not recommend different comps axle to axle to someone who doesn't practice car control.

[zhpnsnv]

Okay good! We don't need any Mafia Brethren spinning off the road!

[LivesNearCostco]

It's possible once I replace the rears that my street/OEM wheels (Pilot Super Sport) will have better grip than my current track wheels (Continental XtremeDW). Which is just wrong! But I will try to fix that by getting even stickier tires for the track wheels once the Continentals wear out.

[zhpnsnv]

Yup. Your tire life is all backwards!


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[M0nk3y]

I do practice car control often! Whether I'm any good at it can be debated :santa2
I put two new Michelin Pilot Super Sports on the front, still on the RE-760 rear, which are just at the wear bars now. So far handles fine but I never push the car hard like that and haven't seen any rain since then. Once rears wear out, will replace with PSS also, maybe use those as rain tires for AutoX and track days.

Here's what the fronts looked like just before replacement. Inside edges had corded from extra negative camber. Had them flipped to get an extra 2 months life.
9565

What camber are you running?

I'd find it hard to believe that you're wearing inside due to camber.

What toe are you running?

I'm running -2.3 at 0 toe and I'm still wearing my outside tires hard.

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[LivesNearCostco]

Yeah but I have two sets of wheels. The street front tires in the picture spent about half their life at -2.0° and maybe half at -2.5°. But rarely pushed hard to wear the outside edges. Almost all the hard driving happened on the other set of wheels set to -3.0° camber. Toe varied from about 1/16" toe-in to 1/16" toe-out, depending what camber settings I was using. Again most of the toe-out driving was on the track tires.

I think if I had one set for both street and track, the wear would be fairly even or even more on the outer shoulder.