Materials to Maintain Your ZHP IIIII Hand Protection IIIII Tools to Maintain Your ZHP
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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    32.8 N, 117.3 W
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    7,640
    Quote Originally Posted by BCS_ZHP View Post
    "On my Wives 06 330 Cabriolet..." -- want to better understand how you get your multiple "wives" to share a cabriolet???? I'd like to be able to do that, either or, have multiples or have them agree on something, lol.
    hahahahahaha

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Salt Lake City, UT
    Posts
    6,871
    Instead of starting a new thread, can someone recommend some decent rear brake pads? Mine need changing. Nothing crazy, just a decent replacement.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    18,064
    There are also some good discussions that exist on here with brake pad opinions. I'll see if I can find one.
    Randeaux/Rando/John/jr - '06 Cic ZHP; Southern California
    "ZHP or not, I still like you"


    ZHP Performance Package, Cold Weather Package, Leather, Jet Black/Black/BlackCube, NAV, Anthracite Black "my individual" interior trim
    ESS Stage 1 Twin Screw Supercharger, Sprint Booster, BMW Perf Intake, Magnaflow Exhaust, Dinan TB & STEP S/W, UCC Sway Bars, Apex EC-7 18x8.5 ET38
    Suspension: AST 44100 dampers, Bimmerworld front adjustable end links, Swift springs (8K front, 10K rear), Vorshlag camber plates
    Dynavin D99+, Hardwire V1 (w/V1 Connection), BSW Stage 1 Speakers, Kicker Amp/Subwoofer
    BMW Performance Strut Brace, Orion V2 Angel Eyes, No-holes License Plate, SMG Paddle Shift Mod, Besian VANOS, Gold DISA, Fan Delete, M3 Side Mirrors
    Note: Actual car no longer resembles signature picture

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Vancouver, Canada
    Posts
    3,588
    First when you're about to switch to a different brake pad setup you want to gauge what you want in braking feel.

    Low Dust vs More Dust,
    More initial bite vs less initial bite, and
    Higher temperature range vs average temperature range,
    Louder vs quiet.


    The lower the dust, generally, the lower initial bite. That's why OEM brake pads that dust a ton have crazy initial bite/grab. When I drove my friend's E46 I had to get used to the grab because it would launch anything sitting still forward if it wasn't buckled up. LOL. Higher temperatures allow you to brake many more times in a short period of time vs only a few panic stops before brake fade starts to creep in. As heat rises in a brake pad, friction becomes less and less depending on what material makes up the brake pad material because the byproduct is more gas in between the rotor and pad. So certain materials have a higher threshold for heat, therefore affording a friction that you feel is good enough for slowing down in a hurry. Some pads behave with more noise than others just because they have a harder material that can generally handle more heat and last much longer at the cost of premature rotor wear. Think of a high performance pad as a fingernail across a chalkboard vs an average performing pad as chalk across a chalkboard. One squeals and wears a little vs the other is quiet yet wears quickly.

    This seems like a good read here:
    http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/c...y/viewall.html

    Blank rotors are great for street application, longevity, and price,
    Slotted or drilled rotors are great for more aggressive driving so that those holes/slots allow hot brake pad gases to escape faster to alleviate brake fade.
    Slotted rotors are usually less pricier than drilled by a small amount but much more cost than blanks. Another myth of slotted/drilled are they allow for better wet performance when the rotor is cold at high speed. I've felt that in the rain and not using the brakes for a few miles on the highway my blanks took a second to the squeeze out the water which added to my braking distance. Changing to drilled lessened that dramatically for me. I've used slotted to and felt the same. I did find my drilled Zimmerman rotors had very fine micro-fractures at the holes but never did I feel that my rotors were just going to brake apart inside my wheel hub. Slotted never had the "cracking" issue.

    A rule that BMW maintenance purist follow are they never machine rotors or reuse them on the next pad change. When I went to machine my new slotted rotors because of warping the machines couldn't do it because they were slotted. I bought Zimmerman drilled for $120 per front corner since I needed them asap. The shop said the machines will either machine blanks or drilled that are parallel/the same hole on each side. My friend machined a BMW OEM blank that was warped but after a California coast road-trip from Vancouver through San Fran and the Grand Canyon, they warped again. So it seems like just replacing rotors when they get warped or on 1st pad change is a good choice to go because now more time is needed to replace just the rotors on the car.

    I run Stoptech Street Performance pads on my car because I can be aggressive with my brakes and I like having the security that my brake pads won't overheat as quickly. I found tracking my car on this tight 1.4 mile track...

    ...that OEM brakes could only hold up to a max of 20 minutes of abuse. The straight away speed I got up to the top of 3rd gear which is around 80-85MPH then brake hard for a 20mph hairpin turn. At the 17-18 minute mark the brakes were smelling strong and brakes felt mushy. This could also be a shared cause of brake fluid overheating which causes it to boil. When I was bedding my Stoptech brake pads during one evening I wanted to see how many times I could stop so I would go up to 60mph and slow down to 10mph aggressively without ABS intervening. I don't remember how many times I did it but I think I did it at least 10 times and there was only a hint of brake pad smell so I braked a few more times but the braking felt close to the same amount of bite as the first try. By then my front rotors were glowing so it was time to take off slowly and NOT STOP to let the rotors cool.

    My Stoptechs feel more linear without that hard OEM initial bite because they emit hardly any dust which is orange/rust in color. It takes a long time to make me feel the need to clean the wheels which I love. They bite perfectly fine when cold and they are built to handle to heat. There is no noise from them but as I said that initial jolt is much less. That's not to say they don't stop fast. You get used to it and I can initiate ABS anytime I wanted. Some people enjoy that initial bite because it instills a confidence that isn't found in most non-German vehicle manufacturer brake setup. I know I loved that the car felt it could stop lightening quick! But once I got used to how the car drove and I wanted to feel the performance aspect out of it, I changed the pads so I could have a more linear feeling. Squeeze more and get more brakes instead of the OEM method: squeeze a little, get a ton of brake, and have to let off the pedal so a slow down isn't too premature.

    Oh and BTW an M3 setup on a 330 would require a whole new suspension/subframe swap to make it all fit. It's cheaper to get an aftermarket Big Brake Kit (BBK) that's made to fit a non-M E46.

    There you have it! That's what I know about brakes. If anything is wrong then I accept gladly to be corrected. LOL. I'm always learning too!
    --Trevor--
    Vancouver, BC

  5. #15
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Jacksonville, Florida
    Posts
    2,202
    Quote Originally Posted by M0nk3y View Post
    Blank rotors, higher aggressive pad.

    You'll outbreak any 135i or M3.

    KISS. Going to M3 rotors and calipers or any other option will just add unnecessary weight.
    Came here for this. Thank you.

    I've always been curious though. What's the point of a pad with more "bite". If your brakes can trigger your ABS to kick in, then you can't brake any faster. Does the extra "bite" lower that threshold so your brakes can trigger ABS quicker?


    Also cross drilled and slotted rotors dont last as long as blanks. You pay to play.
    2005 Jet Black 6MT ZHP "Family First"
    ~Rob~

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Branford, CT
    Posts
    16,055
    Quote Originally Posted by Newjack View Post
    Came here for this. Thank you.

    I've always been curious though. What's the point of a pad with more "bite". If your brakes can trigger your ABS to kick in, then you can't brake any faster. Does the extra "bite" lower that threshold so your brakes can trigger ABS quicker?


    Also cross drilled and slotted rotors dont last as long as blanks. You pay to play.
    More bite means better pedal modulation, which means easier threshold braking. Threshold braking is more effective than ABS braking.

    I'll take a firm brake pedal with bite over ABS any day of the week.

    Granted, this won't help you on the street, but there is something to be said about not having to push as far on the pedal to scrub off a little speed here and there.

    Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX HD
    BP
    2005 330i ZHP / 6MT
    Imolarot / Naturbraun
    2003 330iT / 6MT
    Orientblau / Naturbraun




    It's not the car you drive, it's how you drive it.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Central California
    Posts
    687
    Quote Originally Posted by Avetiso View Post
    Instead of starting a new thread, can someone recommend some decent rear brake pads? Mine need changing. Nothing crazy, just a decent replacement.
    Well, for street use I like Wagner Thermo-Quiet pads. Nothing fancy. They just work with no surprises.

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Cleveland/Dayton
    Posts
    2,620
    Quote Originally Posted by az3579 View Post
    More bite means better pedal modulation, which means easier threshold braking. Threshold braking is more effective than ABS braking.

    I'll take a firm brake pedal with bite over ABS any day of the week.

    Granted, this won't help you on the street, but there is something to be said about not having to push as far on the pedal to scrub off a little speed here and there.

    Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX HD
    +1

    As well actual braking distance is determined on tires, not pads


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


    Project STX: TCKline Racing l APEX l Vorshlag l Eibach l Hawk l Schroth l BMW Performance

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    672
    So I've been reading about the trade off in dust and initial bite, and that ceramics, while preferred by most, and producing less dust, don't have the bite that the oem pads have. I thought, what if I were to use ceramics in combination with drilled or slotted rotors? and then I see Bruce already posted how he gets a nice bite from that combo. Seeing as how I own one of his previous cars now, I think I will take that as a sign and go the same route.
    Mind ye, I do not track the car, nor do I plan on doing so. Just want to cut down on brake dust without sacrificing stopping power. Plus if I buy from FCP, who cares if they wear faster?
    Here is what I want to get:

    Zimmerman drilled rotors
    Akebono pads
    SS lines

    I would love your input, and any suggestions if you have any.

    George

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Posts
    3,130
    Nice revival on this 5 year old wealth of information. I mean, just look at @Rovert up there sharing well thought out technical advice instead of spamming CSL trunk pics!

    I went deep into the search for greater initial bite years ago too and took away the same general idea of cross drilled rotors helping bite a bit. They will slightly increase dusting (think cheese grater), but it's really about finding the happy place between dust and bite.

    I'm still looking for a good method for handling brake dust so that I can go back to OE pads/rotors for that slap-yo-momma-good bite.

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