Wet sanding to achieve show car finish

[diverse]

Does anyone have any experience wet sanding?

I used to wet sand at a body shop
essentially you can really make a car look like a show car just with a 30 dollars worth of sand paper
a few buckets of water and a lot of elbow grease.

From what I see the paint on the bmw has not too much orange peel so getting the surface I am discussing is not too much

I would recommend going with 3ms water da if you have a compressor
I got some great results

but it is not neseccary

if you have no experience wet sanding do not try this.
or if you want to try it out buy a old hood from a junk yard
on a cheap car
and practice on that.

first you will need a squeegie and a soft block
i like the sponge blocks because they follow the contours of the lines of a car.
this is important because the edges and lines and corners are where there is the least amount of paint and these areas easily burn
for a beginner do not sand over the lines at all just come as close as you can without touching them.


first use 1000 grit sand paper
using an x pattern in a 10x10 area sand with a wet piece of sand paper folded around a block.
take a full sheet cut it in half the short way
in other words if you held it so it was longer from right to left cut it down the middle

fold this around the block so that you have two surfaces exposed and a third surface hidden behind one of the exposed surfaces

mix some warm water with a little dish detergent
important keep that paper and car wet
over a clean car
work the x patterns in the 10x10 area periodically checking with the squeegie
if you see little orange peel like texture it means the paint is not flat
keep working until the area is a solid dull even acrross the 10x10
as soon as you achieve this result move to another section
if you see one or two down worry about it
move on getting that last stubborn low may make you burn through your clear coat.

when you are done with the car

wash it off and come back with 1,500 sand paper
doing the same thing.
as before using x patterns
try to count your strokes and keep your pressure the same

when you have complted 1,500

repeat the process using 2,000

i have done this going all the way to 3000
and have achieved crazy good results.

when you are all done
you are ready for the polishing wheel

using a light buffing pad
hit it with compound
and again with glaze

then wax with some carnuba

this whole process will probably take you a weekend

to do a car.

find a used hood or fender and practice
go through all the steps so you see how it comes out

i would do at least 7 panels before attempting to do this with your actual car

the work will pay for itself

and you probably will find your friends willling to pay you 400 to do their cars.

[Avetiso]

This is interesting if you care to remove the orange peel from the car.

[wsmeyer]

I did mine two weeks after I bought it. Nothing like putting sandpaper to a brand new car, the wife thought I was crazy. What you'll end up with is a car that looks shinier even when it's dirty because you can see things much more clearly in the reflection.

[Vas]

I have done the wetsanding process before and used a 3m system to achieve amazing results.

[diverse]

Wow Very very brave. I was the designated wet sander at the body shop where I trained.
and I am not sure I would want to do it to my new car

very very brave.

But yes you get a finish that is unbelievable.

[BCS_ZHP]

Did this with an e39 that had chalky & cracked clear coat on the hood. Somewhere on here is a thread where I described the 35+ hours required to triple wet sand (1500/1500/3500) and triple buff (medium/fine/super fine) the whole car back to its original glory. It was one heck of a lot of work accomplished over one long weekend with a professional detailer by my side using all of his tools of the trade plus his years of professional knowledge, the result was truly amazing.

Would I ever do it again, absolutely NO -- I didn't get the personal satisfaction of having done it myself, was scared to death that I had screwed it up after the first buffing, about half way thru I was toast and just wanted it to be complete, knew there was no way to get it done other than to stick to it myself. If I ever needed to do this again, I'd hire a professional. Yeah, they charge something like $500 for this type of job but my 35+ hours are worth something. Now put a wrench in my hand and give me something mechanical to work on, I'm as happy as a dog with a bone.

[M0nk3y]

I've only done spot wetsanding for scratches

[terraphantm]

I've considered this, but it's something I'd rather leave to a professional. As it is, simply going over the whole car with a DA buffer once made the car shine better than 99% of the cars out there.

[Smolck]

Clay bar, easier than wet sanding.

[diverse]

clay bar is pretty impressive but it is a different effect with clay bars you remove contaminates but you are not flattening the clear.
you can get some stunning results though once you go back with some polish.


I have to admit for the amount of effort it takes to clay bar and then go back over with the wheel I may opt that route 80% of the time

but if you really want that show car finish and your vehicle has heavy orange peel you have to wet sand out that orange peel.

[bullfrogs_M3]

Now I am curious......what does orange peel even look like? How would you know if you had it? I assume for other colors (other than black I mean) it may be easier to see this come through after a good color correction or polish job.

[diverse]

ok I am not being funny but the next time you are in front of an orange really notice the texture
look really close
do you see the little holes they aren't really holes they are indentations
the surface of the orange is actually uneven
filled with little craters
well your paint on any production car has this same thing in varying degrees

some companies have very little orange peel other companies have an almost unacceptable amount.

take for example 2007-2011 altimas the orange peel on these cars is very unacceptable in my opinion I am not sure what they were thinking

how do you see it? well you are already seeing it but you probably do not know what you are looking at.

the best way to catch orange peel is from an angle and you have to learn to look deeply into the paint.

I am not sure this can be taught
I worked in a body shop with low light and began using a fluorescent light that was meant for Paintless dent repair
this light allowed me to see things in the paint that were normally invisible.
My teacher who has 30 years experience can see even deeper than I can
and his brother even deeper than him

it was after wet sanding with this light that my eyes were able to see the subtle nuances in paint.

this hurried my progression but nothing beats getting up close and personal with your paint.

the best suggestion I have for you if you cant see the orange peel that is in your car
is to get an old hood or fender
and do the wet sanding procedure I outlined

when you rub the squeegee over the newly sanded area
the orange peel will pop out and will look just like the texture of an orange

it is the shine of the car that helps hide the orange peel
the wax settles into the lows making them less apparent

[diverse]

as far as polishers go they in a sense are doing what wet sanding does

the purpose of a heavy polish is to remove scratches and to even out the paint

but even the heavy polish leaves behind scratches often seen as swirl marks

so you use a glaze with a softer less aggressive appliacator

this glaze removes the scratches left behind by the heavy polish

then you wax which fills in the scratches left behind by the glaze. which by the way are practically invisible

when you wet sand you are going back a few steps
the wet sanding is levelling the clear coat.

my teacher will do this differently he will start with 600 which to me is bizaare and he uses a DA
but he has 30 years experience so he can get away with this
then he will knock down the scratches of the 600 with 1000 and then 1,500
then he will buff with first a wool pad
then come back with the sponge pad with glaze.

I would never start with 600 nor would I start with a DA
although I have used DA with 1000-3000 sand paper.

This is for a show car finish
it does take time to learn but not a life time
once you have done 8 panels I think you are ready to tackle your car.

[M0nk3y]

even with a heavy compound, you can still removing the marring left behind by lighter polishes.

As well, people should know that when you wet sand, you are compromising the clear coat and daily durability will be affected.

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[diverse]

yes I agree based on the skill of the person using the wheel and what pads he chooses.

but typically you use heavy polish followed by glaze.
and you use a more aggressive pad followed by a finishing pad.

as your skill develops you may develop your own methods.


as far as wet sanding compromising the clear.
It does remove half to nearly a layer of clear
typically clear is shot in two coats.
so though scary sounding is not an issue

you may actually remove close to one whole coat of clear doing a proper wet sand

In our shop I sometimes used three coats of clear so that we can do a better wet sand job after.
but just as often we only used two and still wetsanded fully and no car was ever returned due to clear coat failure.

some manufacturers used suspect clears that failed
like the fords in the late 80's but this had nothing to do with polishing methods it was just an issue with their clear coats.

with past history like this I don't blame many detailers who worked through the 80-90 decades for being overly cautious.

but if you are intending to keep your car immaculate with
wax
then you absolutely should have no problem with your clear coat's durability.

This brings up another show car technique
that is cheaper than repainting your car.

you can wetsand down to 600 and reshoot the car in clear let it dry
and wet sand that to 800
then shoot another coat of clear.
wet sand that to 800 again
then shoot your final coat of clear
and wetsand 1,000 1,500 2000 and then polish and glaze.
shooting a car in clear is very easy to do and is by far cheaper then shooting color coats.
and will add a new paint job look to your vehicle without the cost. of color coats.

[M0nk3y]

I've never use glazes. I will, for example use M105 with a heavy cutting pad, followed by M205 or 106FF with a cutting pad, and then PO85RD with a non-cutting pad for jeweling.

You make a valid example on the clear coat and the multiple layers, but for example you get a bird hit that finds its way to bake in the clear coat (during work this could very happen), now that you wet sanding, you room for extra removal is reduced.

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[diverse]

your method is intriguing and demonstrates your proficiency with a wheel.

you achieve the same or similar results as the mfr suggested methods simply by changing pads
you probably are also without even realizing it adjusting your technique dramatically pressure speed amount of compound how many passes etc.

I was taught using glazes such as ebony glaze and k 30 as my compound using wool shlagel pads
today I use the 3m system

I still like wool pads but many will use sponge pads instead of wool.

I get your bird example though bird droppings can leave some stubborn spots on clear coat
And as you say with the reduced layer you may burn through but wouldn't the subsequent layers of wax prevent the bird dropping acids from attaching to your clear?

[bullfrogs_M3]

I've never use glazes. I will, for example use M105 with a heavy cutting pad, followed by M205 or 106FF with a cutting pad, and then PO85RD with a non-cutting pad for jeweling.

You make a valid example on the clear coat and the multiple layers, but for example you get a bird hit that finds its way to bake in the clear coat (during work this could very happen), now that you wet sanding, you room for extra removal is reduced.

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Interesting discussion you guys, thanks for the info.

Monkey, why not use a Glaze? Doesn't doing a glaze layer provide an additional layer of protection, like a polish, sealant and/or wax layer?

[M0nk3y]

Interesting discussion you guys, thanks for the info.

Monkey, why not use a Glaze? Doesn't doing a glaze layer provide an additional layer of protection, like a polish, sealant and/or wax layer?

Glaze typically is used as a filler, not as much as a type of protection.

In addition, some sealants (at least the ones I use) need fresh paint to properly bond and create a protection layer (prepping usually involves spraying 50/50 IPA/Water to get everything off the paint)

With glaze, you inhibit this type of bonding that you need, and you seriously effect the durability of a sealant.

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[bullfrogs_M3]

Hmmm didn't know about the 50/50 mix after polishing. I will have to do that next time I do a polish job before I use Jet Seal.

Thanks for the info.

[diverse]

I concur I never really thought about glaze being a filler I always looked at it as a super mild abrasive.

but when I think about it we use glaze after painting a vehicle because we cannot use wax. on freshly painted cars.

and it ends up super shiny would an abrasive had added such a shine?

you taught me something