All new suspension, alignment is out of spec

[yod88]

Hey,
Im trying to figure out why this is being caused...I just finished doing a suspension refresh on my zhp (lemforder parts)..I replaced struts, strut hats, control arms, control arm bushings, tierods and sway bar endlinks and on the back of the car i did the shocks and rear shock mount...everything came out and went back in without any real issue...

I went to an alignment this morning and the report says my caster on the front right is about a degree off...and driver side camber is about a degree off as well. (I dont have the report with me at the moment but I will post my alignment specs later today) my wheel is also not perfectly centered when tracking straight (though my steering angle is 0 degrees on the report)...since e46's dont have camber or caster adjustment, any idea of what is going on?

is it possible that because of the new parts that they just have to wear-in?
any place to start looking specifically?

nothing is bent and it all went in smoothly, and to my knowledge things such as the strut hats are identical left and right, so it shouldnt throw off any measurements.


Got my measurements...only ones of concern are in bold
Front left:
Camber .1 deg should be -.4 to -1.1...would like to figure this one out
Caster 5.3deg
toe .12 deg

Front right:
Camber -1.3 deg should be -.4 to -1.1...slightly more negative but not the cause of issue i dont think
caster 4.6 deg should be 5.1 to 6.1...would like to figure this one out
toe .11 deg

left rear:
camber -1.7 deg should be -1.8 to -2.3 (only .1 off, not really worried)
toe .15 deg

right rear:
camber -2.1 deg
toe .14 deg

steer head is .01deg
thrust angle is .01 deg

Thanks for the input

[danewilson77]

Caster cannot be corrected. It is, what it is.

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[Avetiso]

Any accidents?

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[slater]

Caster cannot be corrected. It is, what it is.

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correction -

it can be corrected with camber + caster adjustable top mounts. also, perhaps if the FCAB housing bolt holes were slotted...

peter

[yod88]

Any accidents?

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car aligned perfectly last time i had it done...this is specific to the install (off topic but your OB zhp looks great, haha)



updated initial post with alignment specs

[danewilson77]

correction -

it can be corrected with camber + caster adjustable top mounts. also, perhaps if the FCAB housing bolt holes were slotted...

peter

Sure. Did not know you had this mod.

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[Dave1027]

Sounds like the alignment shop who just did it screwed up. One degree is quite a bit. You should be able to visually see that amount. Plus, the off center steering means they screwed up the thrust angle/toes. May want to take it somewhere else.

[yod88]

Sure. Did not know you had this mod.

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Just to clarify, I am on stock suspension, no mods on the car

seems to me the caster on the front right is the primary reason why im pulling to the right...car wants to go where the least positive caster setting is in most situations correct?

[danewilson77]

Lol. Whatever man.

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[yod88]

Lol. Whatever man.

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? little confused...Slater was talking about camber plates, i was just clarifying to anyone reading that i dont have anything other than stock parts

[danewilson77]

? little confused...Slater was talking about camber plates, i was just clarifying to anyone reading that i dont have anything other than stock parts

All is well. I know. Live with the caster and get as close as possible on camber. I would think they would be able to bring it closer, but also recognize largely camber is not adjustable in the front either.

Did you install your FCAB's IAW TIS?

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[yod88]

All is well. I know. Live with the caster and get as close as possible on camber. I would think they would be able to bring it closer, but also recognize largely camber is not adjustable in the front either.

Did you install your FCAB's IAW TIS?

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Installed via the soap up and press on by hand method...went on easily but maybe this is the cause of the problem...

[LivesNearCostco]

Did you keep or knock out the alignment pins in the front strut mounts? If knocked out, you can adjust a bit of camber. As Dane said, caster is what it is, unless you get adjustable camber/caster plates. My caster was off too. I think they allow caster to differ left/right about up to 0.8 or 1.0 degrees. Your caster difference is about 0.6 or 0.7 degrees, right?

Rear camber is adjustable. Did the shop not try to fix rear camber?

Front camber differences could be caused by ride height differences (spring sag, not seating strut all the way into steering knuckle), past collision, mushroomed strut towers, or user error setting up the alignment rack. My car also pulls to the right all the time on most roads above 40mph, but I cannot figure out how much is caster difference and how much is the front tires following road crown. Because on the rare times when I drive on a road that slopes to the left, the car seems to pull slightly left. I need to take my car to Australia, Japan or England to test fully.

[yod88]

Did you keep or knock out the alignment pins in the front strut mounts? If knocked out, you can adjust a bit of camber. As Dane said, caster is what it is, unless you get adjustable camber/caster plates. My caster was off too. I think they allow caster to differ left/right about up to 0.8 or 1.0 degrees. Your caster difference is about 0.6 or 0.7 degrees, right?

Rear camber is adjustable. Did the shop not try to fix rear camber?

Front camber differences could be caused by ride height differences (spring sag, not seating strut all the way into steering knuckle), past collision, mushroomed strut towers, or user error setting up the alignment rack. My car also pulls to the right all the time on most roads above 40mph, but I cannot figure out how much is caster difference and how much is the front tires following road crown. Because on the rare times when I drive on a road that slopes to the left, the car seems to pull slightly left. I need to take my car to Australia, Japan or England to test fully.

well the weird thing was that they had to do it twice because i went back right after and they saw different number from the first time...I know they did spend time on the rear the second time but I didnt ask specifically what was adjusted...i am going to take it somewhere else this week...

Im going to check on the alignment pins on the shock tonight and reseat the shock assembly in the knuckle...and double check the spring position on the spring pad (though i payed attention to their position when installing)

From my knowledge the caster should differ left to right to compensate for the crown in the road, i forget the actually degree though

[yod88]

Sounds like the alignment shop who just did it screwed up. One degree is quite a bit. You should be able to visually see that amount. Plus, the off center steering means they screwed up the thrust angle/toes. May want to take it somewhere else.


you win the prize... :cheers

Went somewhere else for a 3rd alignment...its all straight now

my conclusion is the tech at the first place either didnt know what he was doing, or the machine was out out of calibration...the place i went for the 3rd alignment was actually quite knowledgeable of e46s and showed even the adjustments made the 2nd time werent accurate by their machine when comparing numbers

[ELCID86]

you win the prize... :cheers

Went somewhere else for a 3rd alignment...its all straight now

my conclusion is the tech at the first place either didnt know what he was doing, or the machine was out out of calibration...the place i went for the 3rd alignment was actually quite knowledgeable of e46s and showed even the adjustments made the 2nd time werent accurate by their machine when comparing numbers

Glad you got it right. Too bad you can't get a refund on the other(s).



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[Smolck]

you win the prize... :cheers

Went somewhere else for a 3rd alignment...its all straight now

my conclusion is the tech at the first place either didnt know what he was doing, or the machine was out out of calibration...the place i went for the 3rd alignment was actually quite knowledgeable of e46s and showed even the adjustments made the 2nd time werent accurate by their machine when comparing numbers

Alignments are a crap shoot. I had one so bad that I absolutely murdered the inside edge of a rear tire as a result of a bad one. They didn't pay for a new tire either. I was NOT happy.

Seems most "shops" don't know how to align a BMW. If I didn't loathe the dealer putting its hands on my girl, I'd take it there. Luckily I have found a place that does pretty well. But again, a lot of shops have given me post alignment printouts that left me scratching my head and clenching my fist.

I'm about to drop some $$ on adjustable rear camber arms. Even though I will loose some handling, I am going to dial some negative camber out of the rear so my tires last longer than 10k miles. Dang staggered tires! I wonder if the shops will even know how to adjust them.......

[Asiah119]

I may have made a post about my alignment woes a while back, but on mine, all four wheels were all way out of spec. I had the shop that had been my regular put it on their rack. When they finished, it was still all sorts of out of spec, but they told me that it was as far as it would go. I asked some friends and got mixed signals about the shops that they took their cars to, so I just admitted defeat and called up the dealer. Dealer said that my FBCA bushings were shot and it never should have gotten an alignment w\o replacing those. I got the bushings, tried to bring my car back to my usual shop, they still couldn't get it in shape. Took it back to BMW, they got it spot on.

My alignment journey taught me what others have said, some shops are just shit at aligning BMWs. The BMW tech that did my car gave me the "don't let them touch your car again, they don't know what they're doing." So now, if i cant' do it myself, I take it to my guy who is an hour away.