Winter Tire Swap - when are you doing it?

[onepercent]

Who's swapping over to their winter tires/wheels?

I'm probably going to do it this weekend or next week. Temps are plenty cold right now. 45 degrees is the point where I feel like I should make the swap, but I tend to err on the side of summer tires because I feel like the winters get so chewed up in warm weather.

[nike001]

Winters definitely do get some excessive wear when its warmer out. It's supposed to be 55,55, & 59 for sat-mon (respectively) so I assume it's about the same where you are.

I'll have the ZHP sit a day or two on thurs-friday if we get any snowfall, but during my commute today I noticed how rock hard my tires were. Me no gusta. I was hoping to be able to stretch it out till next weekend at the earliest. I usually end up swapping a few days before Thanksgiving.

[onepercent]

Yep, I was thinking about waiting till after that little mild stretch they are predicting for the weekend/next week. Once I get the winters on, part of me wants it to snow all the time so that I can use them for what they're made for. Kinda like when I'm driving a truck or SUV, I go out of my way to take it off-road.

[CERF04ZHP]

Who's swapping over to their winter tires/wheels?

I'm probably going to do it this weekend or next week. Temps are plenty cold right now. 45 degrees is the point where I feel like I should make the swap, but I tend to err on the side of summer tires because I feel like the winters get so chewed up in warm weather.

This.
But as my summers were just about bald, and I got a flat two weeks ago, I bolted on my winters a liiiittle early. But generally speaking, a week or so on either side of Thanksgiving is when I normally do it.

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[zhpnsnv]

Typically wait until turkey day or the week(ish) after that in NJ.

[alexandre]

It's been around 35-40F pretty constantly over here in the last few days, so it's probably gonna be this weekend for me. I've got Blizzaks on Style 44's!

[Vas]

I have some conti's dws tires on the factory wheels with plenty of life. Thats my winter set-up.

[gr330zhp]

Yesterday.


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[NorCalZman]

Is it really that important to switch before the first snow fall? Is the alphabet soup of electronic helpers in the ZHPs useless if it snows and you still have summer rubber on?

[ryankokesh]

I'm running the conti dws's too, so not in a big hurry. Probably around thanksgiving for me.

[UdubBadger]

Week of thanksgiving is traditionally when I swap up here in Chicago.

Gotta paint the wheels with Ry this weekend 1st though.


- Goin' H.A.M. Mobile

[zhpnsnv]

Is it really that important to switch before the first snow fall? Is the alphabet soup of electronic helpers in the ZHPs useless if it snows and you still have summer rubber on?

If they're real summers, then yes, useless. There is nothing -- I repeat, nothing -- more important to your car's ability to accelerate, brake and turn than your tire's ability to grip the road. At temperatures below 40, your summers are bricks, and their wide chunks of contact patch = wide hockey pucks of sliding in the snow.

This leads into the whole sham of xdrive. There was a headline somewhere after Sandy to the effect of, "It's Global Warming, Stupid!" My version is, "It's the tires, silly!" Can't remember the last time xdrive helped anyone brake or turn, which is typically how one avoids trouble. But I've digressed to a whole other topic, haven't I? My B.

[NorCalZman]

I didn't mean to hijack the thread. It is just good info for those of us that don't live in the snowbelt. I want to drive to Truckee Friday night but there might be snow showers up there until Friday mid day. Last time I drove up there I got caught in a very cold snow shower (car even beeped at me that it was getting cold) heading over the top of the pass but the ZHP seemed to handle it ok (and I drove slowly).

http://www.weather.com/weather/wxdetail4/USCA1163

Maybe I should wait until Saturday.

[nike001]

My car handles the cold on my summer tires, but it doesn't like it. Tires are loud and TOUGH. They're hard as a rock.

It's the only time I can spin through 1st and get more than just maybe a chirp in 2nd :rofl

[zhpnsnv]

Snow showers, you're fine. Once the snow starts to pack a layer on the road, or turn slushy, you're not fine. I remember one time driving back to college in my E30 on some fairly worn Nittos, I hit a snow storm 1/2 way there. Limped it back to my apt, parked in front and unloaded some crap. Came down 5 min later and was entirely unable to move the car forwards because it was on snow (Nitto summer tires) and a slight incline. Just sat there and spun 'em and actually rolled backwards. Got some hot water to melt the snow a bit to get some traction and Ken Blocked my way into a parking space eventually. This was long before Ken Block was Ken Block, mind you. Well, he was Ken Block, but nobody gave a crap yet.

[NorCalZman]

Ok cool thanks. As long as its still water with the snow ill be ok. If I start to see snow packing on the roads ill find someplace to stop for the night

[az3579]

Is it really that important to switch before the first snow fall? Is the alphabet soup of electronic helpers in the ZHPs useless if it snows and you still have summer rubber on?

Honestly, the electronic aids are crap IMO. All they do is screw up the driver if s/he is trying to drive properly in the snow. Driver skill and snow tires are the most important things to have in the snow.


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[jsfbmw]

Who's swapping over to their winter tires/wheels?

I'm probably going to do it this weekend or next week. Temps are plenty cold right now. 45 degrees is the point where I feel like I should make the swap, but I tend to err on the side of summer tires because I feel like the winters get so chewed up in warm weather.

Great timing for this question. My summer tires started feeling like "bricks" and I'm able to chirp the tires more easily, as other posters noted, and then I realized, time to change to winter setup. So I will be doing the change this weekend.

Last thing I want to have on the car when roads get frosty are summer tires. Also got to use my scraper this morning.

[llll1l1ll]

I live in an area where there's not a lot of snow during winter, so I'm just going to wing it with my Conti DWS setup.

[midlandtech]

Have a fresh coat of plasti dip on the 135's and have all cheap all seasons on I'm hoping that they will be better than high performance tires... I'm more worried that the front lip will act like a snow plow if we get all the snow that is predicted


~Steve
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[zhpnsnv]

All seasons will work, but obviously not as well. I go one step more towards true winter rubber with performance winter tires since studless ice and snow are miserable when it's not snowing. My ZHP was an absolute monster in the snow on perf. winters. I was always on the road before the plows got around. Obviously, three feet of snow kept me home, as it does most. But I'd regularly get through 6-8 inches with DSC OFF as BP said. With that much snow, DSC basically says to you, "turn around and go home because I'm not going to let you drive forward."

[midlandtech]

I agree... If its snowy I usually have dsc off and start in second gear as I will usually start spinning in first


~Steve
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[UdubBadger]

honestly i use winters for their STOPPING qualities - not their starting as DTC usually will do the trick.

[onepercent]

This leads into the whole sham of xdrive. There was a headline somewhere after Sandy to the effect of, "It's Global Warming, Stupid!" My version is, "It's the tires, silly!" Can't remember the last time xdrive helped anyone brake or turn, which is typically how one avoids trouble. But I've digressed to a whole other topic, haven't I? My B.

My thoughts exactly. People think that AWD makes a difference for driving in snow. But it doesn't help braking or turning, which are the real problems that snow presents!!!

A couple guys mentioned driving on Conti DWS, I've driven an Audi with Conti DWS, those are really nice all-season tires. Let us know how they do in the snow.

A few years ago we had that huge December snowstorm (Snowmageddon) in Washington DC when I was there visiting friends. I had not yet swapped over to my winter tires and I didn't dare take my car out in the snow (fortunately it was parked in a covered garage). I waited until the afternoon following the snowstorm so the plows had gone thru and the sun was out melting the snow before I attempted to drive home. Fortunately, by that point all the roads were fine.

And yeah, I agree, DSC off in snow.

[deuce08s]

I'll probably switch mine over before Thanksgiving. I first have to pick up the set I'm buying from someone on Craigslist. I found a set of style M68's with Winter Sport M3s on them...I can't wait! This will be my first car with RWD and winter, so we'll see how that goes! I wanted to buy a beater but I really don't need three cars.....though my ZHP has never seen winter and I really didn't want to start now. Found a great 2005 X3 3.0si with M-Sport package and a 6sp locally for $14300 but just can't justify it.

Any way, end of the month for me unless it start dipping into the 30s here.

[Crickett]

I'm so jealous of all of you with M68s for your winters! I want!

I've generally waited until the temps get to around 42 °F & stay there for more than a few days (or the first snow). But now, being in Vegas & with Conti DWSs on my M135s, I'm thinking I probably won't need dedicated winters . . .

[ryankokesh]

I'm surprised so many people suggest driving with DSC off. I've never personally been told that before, and honestly it doesn't immediately make sense to me. If you're stuck in snow sure, I get turning it off then. But if you're just driving in snow why wouldn't you want the assist? Definitely seems safer to me, as you really don't want to be spinning/sliding at all. (I think...?)

[webster]

i live in texas - no need for winter tires. i run max perf summers year round. silver lining to our dreadful 7 month summers...

[midlandtech]

I'm surprised so many people suggest driving with DSC off. I've never personally been told that before, and honestly it doesn't immediately make sense to me. If you're stuck in snow sure, I get turning it off then. But if you're just driving in snow why wouldn't you want the assist? Definitely seems safer to me, as you really don't want to be spinning/sliding at all. (I think...?)

I will turn mine off if the car is spinning up the tires from a stop but I will usually turn it back on once I get going


~Steve
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[NorCalZman]

Im confused. Isnt the DSC supposed to work with the Traction Control to keep any wheel spinning car sliding shenanigans from happening from a stop or in motion in the first place?

[danewilson77]

Im confused. Isnt the DSC supposed to work with the Traction Control to keep any wheel spinning car sliding shenanigans from happening from a stop or in motion in the first place?

No. It doesn't stop spinning.....per se.

[Washburn]

I'm surprised so many people suggest driving with DSC off. I've never personally been told that before, and honestly it doesn't immediately make sense to me. If you're stuck in snow sure, I get turning it off then. But if you're just driving in snow why wouldn't you want the assist? Definitely seems safer to me, as you really don't want to be spinning/sliding at all. (I think...?)


I would like this clarified too...

I live in NC where we don't get a lot of snow, and hope the Conti DWS can handle any light snow...
For anything more than light, I will use the ol' 97 Tbird with dedicated snow tires (Altimax Arctic)...

[zhpnsnv]

First, DSC makes for uneven acceleration in the snow - stops and starts and sputters. I KNOW how much wheel spin I'm going to get, so I plan accordingly, then DSC steps in and screws it up for me.

Second, if you're driving on packed snow, and you're anticipating some sliding, DSC becomes difficult to correct for and makes for, again, some unpredictability.

If the conditions are such that I'm not sure of them, or if I'm ever in doubt, I drive in the snow with it ON, especially at higher speeds. But for getting through the deep stuff, it's usually off.

Disclaimer: this is all dependent on your feel, comfort, and confidence with how your car is going to react in certain situations. It also helps to be experienced in car control for when crap gets hairy. IF you're not trained in all of that, then it's probably better to let DSC do its job - this is why it was created. What DSC can't do, though, is see what's coming, and therein lies the main difference between it and my hands/feet/eyes: it's reactive and I can be proactive.

[danewilson77]

Yeah......I leave DSC on all the times, and especially if I don't know how the car is going to react, with the various road conditions.

[zhpnsnv]

It saved me once on a normal wet road. Thought I was well within the cornering limits of the car when it started coming around. DSC caught it before my hands did; I was thankful. I'm not thankful when I'm expecting one thing with regard to acceleration or sliding in snow and I get the opposite.

[NorCalZman]

Wow. I have never had a car with any kind of electronic helpers before so this weekend should be interesting. Ill take a look at the owners manual again before we set out.

I wish I could explore these features/the cars limits in a controlled enviroment. I might have to find a big empty lot some rainy day.

[nike001]

I've never had DSC catch me before.. but I've definitely had it get me out of a couple sticky situations in the winter. Ex. front tires in a ditch.. and also driving up my dads driveway that goes up a mtn thats 7/10's of a mile long.

[johnrando]

Definitely try it out if you get a chance. I was at a free BMW driving school and they had us go (accelerate) around a curve in water with DSC off and on. It hugged the curve easily with it on, and skidded with it off, which is what their point was.

[danewilson77]

Good read here for all....

http://www.bmwblog.com/2011/11/22/opposite-lock-dsc-off/

Added here in case questions come up again....

http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?1830-BMW-E46-ZHP-DIY-and-Preventative-maintenance

[ryankokesh]

are you guys just pressing the button once, or totally deactivating it? (holding it down i think). Anyone know exactly what the difference is?

[zhpnsnv]

Depends on conditions. Holding down = totally off.

[3ZHPGUY]

are you guys just pressing the button once, or totally deactivating it? (holding it down i think). Anyone know exactly what the difference is?

Pressing the button once just disables the acceleration reduction. Holding the button down until the brake light stays on completely disables the stability control.

[onepercent]

I should say I mainly have DSC in the off position (weakly off, not fully off) when the DSC is forcing a wheel to stop and I'm trying to go uphill or accelerate. If I'm on the highway or whatever, I'll generally re-engage DSC.

For example, there was one time in my old Audi A4 that I was trying to go uphill in a snowstorm and the ESP wouldn't let me do it. I turned off ESP and cruised right up it.

[Mike V]

I wait for the first forecast of snow, or if the temperatures dip down under 35 degrees for a while. In this area, it's usually the end of November or beginning of December.

For those who have two sets of wheels but running so-called all-seasons... isn't that defeating the purpose of having two sets of wheels?

[gr330zhp]

6228

Put the winter wheels on my moms S4!


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[az3579]

For those who have two sets of wheels but running so-called all-seasons... isn't that defeating the purpose of having two sets of wheels?

Yes, completely defeats the purpose.



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[danewilson77]

Yes, completely defeats the purpose.



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Disagree. If I were to purchase a set of rims....to run in the winter....they would have A/S's on them, and not winters.


Sent from Williamsburg, VA USA

[onepercent]

Yeah, it depends on where you live. For Dane in Southern VA, snow tires probably aren't really necessary, he'd just want a softer tire that does better (relative to summer tires) in rain and occasional snow. Whereas those of us who get regular snow are better off with a proper snow tire.

[zhpnsnv]

Disagree. If I were to purchase a set of rims....to run in the winter....they would have A/S's on them, and not winters.


Sent from Williamsburg, VA USA

For VA I agree with this. Same advice I gave my buddy in NC - just get some A/S and that's it. Up here though, I agree with BP that it would not make much sense.

[Vas]

Where I love in Virginia I get hit with snow a couple of times a year. I just didn't see the point of buying snow tires. If I lived where there was lots of snows, then i would get snow tires since it would pay off.

[terraphantm]

Where I love in Virginia I get hit with snow a couple of times a year. I just didn't see the point of buying snow tires. If I lived where there was lots of snows, then i would get snow tires since it would pay off.

I think it depends more on whether or not you would still be expected to drive during a bad storm. If you would, then snow tires are a must - E46 just blows in snow otherwise.

[Mike V]

I don't know how much snow southern VA gets but if it snows at all I would have winter tires. There are winter tires designed for a lot of snow and winter tires that are actually pretty good on dry roads and still do way better than any no-season will do in the snow. We don't get a large amount of snow here, so I run the Dunlop SP Winter Sport 3D. I've had Blizzaks in the past that were pretty damn terrible on dry roads but coming from a guy who enjoys a twisty road, the Dunlop 3Ds are good on dry, wet, or snowy roads. When I eventually move to Minnesota, I'll move to a tire that leans more toward better snow traction.

If you're going to run all-seasons in the winter, why not run them in the summer too and not have to hassle with swapping wheels twice a year? I'm not trying to sound like an ass (hopefully I'm not), but it really makes no sense to me.

Dane, would you mind elaborating on your last post?

[az3579]

Went rallying this morning on the way to work. First time ever having snow tires, and loving every second of it.

http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa192/az3579/Misc/EBAC221E-F30A-4CDF-A50A-AA962189CA82-15680-00001650B835D449.jpg


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[ryankokesh]

Rallying sounds dangerous. Be careful out there! :thumbsup


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[deuce08s]

I'm so jealous of all of you with M68s for your winters! I want!

I've generally waited until the temps get to around 42 °F & stay there for more than a few days (or the first snow). But now, being in Vegas & with Conti DWSs on my M135s, I'm thinking I probably won't need dedicated winters . . .

Just picked up my M68s last night and they are mint! Got a great deal on them as well! Now, to wait for the right time to slap them on.....I can't wait! Pictures will be posted!

[quikryptonite]

Got our first snowfall in SLC today. I'm planning on putting mine on this weekend.

[NorCalZman]

There are chain controls in the Sierras. I guess I am not going up to Tahoe. At least not for another day or two.

[Alex]

I'll probably wait for the first snow, should be coming any day now...

[zhpnsnv]

Went rallying this morning on the way to work. First time ever having snow tires, and loving every second of it.

http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa192/az3579/Misc/EBAC221E-F30A-4CDF-A50A-AA962189CA82-15680-00001650B835D449.jpg


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That's what I'm talkin' about right there! No plow, 4-6 inches, barely anyone on the road, and lots of fun.

[3ZHPGUY]

I'm attempting to hold out till the Christmas holidays when we go north to visit the family. After growing up in Buffalo, NY then living outside of Cleveland, OH for years, I'm enjoying this extended season in Tennessee. We have had 25 deg. temps but, next to no precipitant.

[onepercent]

I put them on last night. Here's a quick history of my winter tire switch-over dates:

2009: December 23
2010: November 29
2011: October 6 (had to use winters to pass inspection)
2012: November 13

Summer tire on dates:
2010: March 20
2011: March 16
2012: March 20

[alexandre]

I put my Blizzak-wrapped 44's on this morning. I love the gunmetal over Imola look!

http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/9234/photo20121114114138am.jpg

[mcaden]

Like others in my area have said (absent an early snow) my snow tires go on Thanksgiving morning. For fun, watch the tire rack video comparing two 3 series cars driving in snow (braking, turning, and accelerating) one with winter tires and one with all-season tires. See here: http://www.tirerack.com/videos/index.jsp?video=23

[Oli77]

I'm doin' it soon and we'll look like that:

http://i900.photobucket.com/albums/ac208/othibau/DSC06973.jpg

[UdubBadger]

done

[gr330zhp]

I'm doin' it soon and we'll look like that:

http://i900.photobucket.com/albums/ac208/othibau/DSC06973.jpg

X5 3.0i wheels huh? Actually looks pretty good!


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[ryankokesh]

I still think this is one of the most epic setups ever. Some people don't agree... :shifty

https://www.evernote.com/shard/s3/sh/9fe1f1c1-8faf-4771-b4cb-fc06b2dc0584/91ee4523683eed625585d2f155f3dff3/res/21443085-8b88-4f1b-a5c7-9ae5ca095252/skitch.png?resizeSmall&width=832

[UdubBadger]

epic because it shouldn't work for sure.

[Oli77]

Yeah, and thanks.

I bought the wheels not knowing what kind they were (except that they were BMW) of where they came from. $80 for the 4.

[danewilson77]

Yeah, and thanks.

I bought the wheels not knowing what kind they were (except that they were BMW) of where they came from. $80 for the 4.

They should throw your ass in the slammer.

Sent from Williamsburg, VA USA

[nike001]

I still think this is one of the most epic setups ever. Some people don't agree... :shifty

https://www.evernote.com/shard/s3/sh/9fe1f1c1-8faf-4771-b4cb-fc06b2dc0584/91ee4523683eed625585d2f155f3dff3/res/21443085-8b88-4f1b-a5c7-9ae5ca095252/skitch.png?resizeSmall&width=832

http://farm1.staticflickr.com/46/170645523_eacbb1ad37.jpg

[UdubBadger]

he took it down, was the photo of my car when Eli had it with the X5 rims on it.

[ryankokesh]

I didn't take it down...sheese...making it sound like I'm sensoring your car :D

Skitch must have decided it was getting too much traffic... I'll repost when I get home.


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[Oli77]

They should throw your ass in the slammer.

Sent from Williamsburg, VA USA

Yeah I felt a little bad but I also love those moments in life when you can get "free" stuff.

And your sig is phenomemal Ddub!

[nike001]

Just got done putting my wheels on :/

terra had to lend me a socket since my sockets wouldn't fit in any of my non-broken ratchets. He also let me use his torque wrench so I'm up to BMW spec! I used to just do nicentight.