Disa, vanos, or?

[Avetiso]

First of all, I am not getting any codes. Car passed smog easy.

Whenever I give a decent level of throttle around 2.5k-5k, my throttle beings to pulsate. Really weird feeling. Also, when I turn off the car, I get a clicking sound in the engine. Clicks 4-7 times.

Help a brother out. I get the feeling these are somehow connected.

Somebuddy on E46F suggested fuel pump gon' die thoon.

[Avetiso]

Don't be shy. :eeps

[wsmeyer]

When people talk about the DME update problem or the DISA problem they usually describe a single dip in power that recovers. Can you locate the clicking? Almost sounds like a fuel pressure problem.

[Avetiso]

When people talk about the DME update problem or the DISA problem they usually describe a single dip in power that recovers. Can you locate the clicking? Almost sounds like a fuel pressure problem.
I'll try to find the clicking today. It's not a single dip, tho. It's a few seconds long of a pulsating feeling in the throttle.

[Terry]

I'm thinking wsmeyer is onto something. I had a friend have a similar sympton with his Z4.. He didn't mention this clicking noise. We addressed it by doing a DME update. Unfortunately he hasn't called me since :( This means his car is working fine ;)

-Terry

[alexandre]

The DISA and DME recall is one single dip at 4,000 rpm. Otherwise it can be a bunch of stuff... Maybe clogged fuel filter? Clogged injectors? Vacuum leaks (intake boots, VCG). I've never driven a car with a bad VANOS so I can't comment on that but it could definitely be an issue. Think of your mileage and the maintenance schedule we follow and see what probably hasn't been done by PO. If your DISA is OE and DME isn't the latest (7561520) I'd probably tackle that first, as the latest DME is a world of difference in throttle response, smoothness and MPG compared to the OE versions.

Fuel pump usually dies at 120k. Definitely wouldn't make it a priority right now. All the 7-9 y.o. dry and cracked rubbers and plastics are probably more worthy of your attention :)

[llll1l1ll]

The DME update might be able to fix that throttle pulsation you speak of. Mine does a similar thing.

Not sure about your clicking, though.

[Avetiso]

How can I get my DME updated? It does not look like my PO maintained this car well (one of the ills of buying from an auction, but I am more than willing to cover his sins). I understand there is an SIB post for me to use, but my car is not under warranty. What would it cost to get this done?

Looks like I just have a bucket list of stuff to do.

[Avetiso]

I'm thinking wsmeyer is onto something. I had a friend have a similar sympton with his Z4.. He didn't mention this clicking noise. We addressed it by doing a DME update. Unfortunately he hasn't called me since :( This means his car is working fine ;)

-Terry

It is always like that, huh? Thank you for the help. Gonna try a DME update.

[MrMaico]

When my car needed the DME update it had the miss at between 2800 to 3000 rpm under anything over about 1/2 throttle in the higher gears. It only affected that small rpm range. It was a major engine miss/misfire, easily felt, on and off sensation. Updating to the newest DME software cured it completely. Doesn't sound like what you're describing though.

When you say the throttle pulsates, do you mean the actual pedal or is it the engine pulsating? How many miles are on your car? It kinda sounds like what people describe with a failing fuel pump but that's just a guess. Maybe Dane or someone that has had a fuel pump go out might have a better idea.

Barry

[Nivo]

On my car I only had the bucking feeling from 2500 rpms till about 3000 rpms. Watching my air fuel and other information from the sensors I saw 2 things. The airl fuel being rich and MAF, fuel trims off.

Turned out to be the intake rubber boots. about a week later I got codes. I replaced that and about a few months later it started again. One of the CCV hoses cracked.

Vacuum leaks can cause this symptom skewing your DME and airfuel. It may not be your problem since all the way past 3000 rpms when you are experiencing it.

[MrMaico]

I had mine updated at an indy shop for a little over a hundred bucks. Some people have had trouble convincing a dealer to do an update but it can't hurt to ask. Or if you can find someone who knows how to use the available software it can be done by anyone.

[Nivo]

When my car needed the DME update it had the miss at between 2800 to 3000 rpm under anything over about 1/2 throttle in the higher gears. It only affected that small rpm range. It was a major engine miss/misfire, easily felt, on and off sensation. Updating to the newest DME software cured it completely. Doesn't sound like what you're describing though.

When you say the throttle pulsates, do you mean the actual pedal or is it the engine pulsating? How many miles are on your car? It kinda sounds like what people describe with a failing fuel pump but that's just a guess. Maybe Dane or someone that has had a fuel pump go out might have a better idea.

Barry

Funny you just mentioned that, My car only did it with the torn boots and hose. when I first bought the car it didn't do it. Mine was the same as your but turned out to be vacuum leaks.

[Avetiso]

When my car needed the DME update it had the miss at between 2800 to 3000 rpm under anything over about 1/2 throttle in the higher gears. It only affected that small rpm range. It was a major engine miss/misfire, easily felt, on and off sensation. Updating to the newest DME software cured it completely. Doesn't sound like what you're describing though.

When you say the throttle pulsates, do you mean the actual pedal or is it the engine pulsating? How many miles are on your car? It kinda sounds like what people describe with a failing fuel pump but that's just a guess. Maybe Dane or someone that has had a fuel pump go out might have a better idea.

Barry
It's not the peddle itself. When I hit the throttle, the car itself begins it pulsate. It accelerates, but as it accelerates, there is a tiny rocking back and forth in the car, which I am pretty sure is the engine itself not delivering smooth power. I'll drive it again today, and see when are where I get it in terms of RPM.

In the meantime, someone please tell me about getting my DME updated. My car is out of warranty obviously. Will the dealer still do it for free? How much does it cost? Can someone link me to the SIB for the DME?

[Avetiso]

Indy in Vallejo wants 216$ for a reflash. Not a lot of reputable indys in Sacramento.

[MrMaico]

Here is an older thread with a bunch of info about this update. There are about 3 different SIB numbers mentioned in the thread though.

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=833003

I asked tech guru Mike Miller about that SIB 12-08-05 once and he said it was something for the Xi models so I don't know if that is right or not. I Googled it before and didn't find any helpful (official) info. Basically you just need to find someone who will download the latest software version. Dealers more than likely won't do it for free anymore.

If it's not in just that narrow rpm band though then I'd have my doubts about that being your problem. Also, when mine needed the update I would get a hidden code (no light) on my Peake reader for a 2974 (O2 sensor code).

Here's some more info about it.....

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=445105&highlight=

[Avetiso]

Thank you for the info. After looking around, it seems people have this issue at different rpm ranges, often fixed by a dme flash. Regardless, I think I need to get that done.

I've scanned my car a few times and I've gotten no codes besides ambient temp sensor, which I fixed. (it was torn off) No other codes besides that. I'll call my dealer and ask them about it.

[MrMaico]

Thank you for the info. After looking around, it seems people have this issue at different rpm ranges, often fixed by a dme flash. Regardless, I think I need to get that done.

I've scanned my car a few times and I've gotten no codes besides ambient temp sensor, which I fixed. (it was torn off) No other codes besides that. I'll call my dealer and ask them about it.

Certainly won't hurt anything and it's nice to have done regardless. It seemed to help overall. Maybe a little more power, smoother idle. I can't say for sure I noticed any other differences but lots of other people have. I wish I'd tried it before doing my Vanos since it didn't change anything when I installed the Beisan seals. It's nice to know though that they are done though, would have needed to do them sooner or later.

[Washburn]

Can you record the clicking sound?

[Avetiso]

I want to apologize. I was exhausted when I first noticed the issue last night. Drove the car today for like 20 miles, and did a few pulls. Hesitation is around 2.6k-3k, no where near up to 5k. So I am pretty set on DME.

As far as the kicking noise goes, I'll try to record it when I have someone to turn the car off for me at home. In a few hours.

:facepalm Feel pretty stupid right now.

[alexandre]

Try your local dealer. Mine did the tail light recall for free on my car in June 2012, the warranty expired in 2005 and it's never been CPO'd. I think recalls are free for the life of the car.

[Avetiso]

Called Niello BMW Sacramento. They said they can't flash the DME by itself, they need to flash/encode everything hooked up to it (tranny, etc). $345 to do it all....?

[alexandre]

BS. Tranny doesn't have software lol, you have a manual. DME is definitely upgradable by itself. Local dealer quoted 1h30 labor @ $125/hr. Have them lookup this SIB: http://www.linquist.net/motorsports/bmw/sib121705.txt

Check your DISA too, as the older model definitely had something to do with the stumbles. Revised version is P/N #11617544805. Check under it for your part #.

[Avetiso]

I get the feeling the guy doesn't know what he is talking about. =/ I have 2 SIB's. One is hesitation at 2.5k-3k, the other is yours, for the 4k dip. Which one do I use? Both?

[alexandre]

What's the # on the first one ?

[Avetiso]

SIB 12 08 05

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?p=14277839

^look at post #40.

[alexandre]

http://www.e90post.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=142581&d=1207312681

This list of SIB's suggest it's related to O2 sensors. It says E60 but it says E60 next to the DME recall too.

6675

[Avetiso]

I've read up on it. The O2 sensors are good, it's the DME making them throw a code. Bunch of other people had the issue.

[MrMaico]

I want to apologize. I was exhausted when I first noticed the issue last night. Drove the car today for like 20 miles, and did a few pulls. Hesitation is around 2.6k-3k, no where near up to 5k. So I am pretty set on DME.

As far as the kicking noise goes, I'll try to record it when I have someone to turn the car off for me at home. In a few hours.

:facepalm Feel pretty stupid right now.

Good to hear! That does sound like you need the update now. Now all you have to do is find a shop that knows what the hell they're talking about and knows the procedure.

Barry

[Avetiso]

Niello still wants $325 flat rate for the job. Ridiculous. Gonna try to find an indy.

[johnrando]

There's a SoCal local who will do it for $150. Not that that helps you in the Bay Area, but it gives you an idea of how low the price can get. Check on the "California" section on e46f.c to see if there are any Bay Area shade tree mechanics.

[Avetiso]

There's a SoCal local who will do it for $150. Not that that helps you in the Bay Area, but it gives you an idea of how low the price can get. Check on the "California" section on e46f.c to see if there are any Bay Area shade tree mechanics.

I'm actually in Sacramento. Not the bay. I have a few indys I'm gonna call tomorrow and see what is up.

Sent from the grave. They have Wi-Fi down here.

[johnrando]

Yeah I know, but it's all the Bay Area to us in SoCal. (Not really, but had to get my dig in). What I meant was that there is a NorCal section.

[Avetiso]

Well I found an indy here than can do it for $135. Now it is just a matter of time.

[johnrando]

Wow, $135! Great price.

[danewilson77]

Well I found an indy here than can do it for $135. Now it is just a matter of time.

DME update?

[alexandre]

Since this is a "click update and wait" operation, they might be willing to do it for cheaper if you're having them do other work. Say fluids, etc... think about what's due and try to get a few things out of the deal :) I know a local guy had it done for $40 while flushing all fluids and doing a brake job.

[Avetiso]

Yessir. Gettin some bad hesitation around 2.5-3k.

[Avetiso]

Since this is a "click update and wait" operation, they might be willing to do it for cheaper if you're having them do other work. Say fluids, etc... think about what's due and try to get a few things out of the deal :) I know a local guy had it done for $40 while flushing all fluids and doing a brake job.
Not a bad idea, thanks! Although in all honesty, I can't think of anything. Brakes are good, coolant is new, oil only has 7k on it. Only thing I can think of is the DME. =/

[Avetiso]

Does anyone know if I need different updates to fix 2.5k-3k as well as the 4k dip? Or will updating to the last firmware cure both issues?

[danewilson77]

Ugh. Lots of discussion on this one. Many claim the 4k dip will only go away by sending the DME to New Jersey. Others claim to have fixed the 4k dip with the GAS DISA rebuild. Some have even said the dealer update fixed it. I'm still unsure.

http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?6885-Quiet-Moments.....with-Jim-Conforti-Addressal-of-the-4k-Power-Dip&highlight=conforti

[RITmusic2k]

Your symptoms sound like a textbook case of the 2,800rpm hesitation. My car has had this since I've owned it; I finally had the dealers update my DME on Monday and I can confirm that the simple dealer reprogramming will correct the problem.

[Avetiso]

Your symptoms sound like a textbook case of the 2,800rpm hesitation. My car has had this since I've owned it; I finally had the dealers update my DME on Monday and I can confirm that the simple dealer reprogramming will correct the problem.
What did it cost you?

[BRGcoopahS]

My car is doing this around the same rpm as well. It usually does it in 2nd gear under slightly aggressive throttle. Normal acceleration it won't happen, and flat out full throttle it won't happen. Let us know if the DME update cures it.

[danewilson77]

What did it cost you?

Dealer should be around onehunabux.

[RITmusic2k]

It was $155 from Sterling BMW in Newport. Probably a little on the higher end of what to expect, but well worth it. Feels like a whole new car to drive it with a smooth powerband right through that sweet spot.

[LivesNearCostco]

I think my indie in Orange County did it for $150. I didn't notice any hesitation before the update so not sure if it fixed anything. The 4K dip shows on the dyno chart both before and after the DME update, but I don't feel that dip when driving.

For Sacramento, did you try calling Schatz and Krum? I'm guessing they'll charge between $150 and $200, but you could probably negotiate a lower price if you're having them do other work on the car.