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Just a guess on my part but I would think it is the fan kicking in at 92. Since mine seems to run at 205F I would think we have a 95C stat. I heard my fan kick in while I was idling the other day but my temp was at 210F iirc. Not sure why yours is kicking it at 92. Faulty temp sensor?Quote:
Originally Posted by LivesNearCostco
It would be nice to know at what temp our T-stat opens up.
So we have the following.
Oli77: 96
Dane: 97 (Won't give us the real number! )
Telijah: 88
edlvrt: 96
MrMaico: 97
Spencers: 90
Livesnearcoscto: 90 (Sounds about right?).
derbo: 95
More data would be great.
I got to wondering today about the stat and why and how it is electrically controlled. According to Bentley.....
The electrically heated thermostat allows the engine to be operated at higher temps at idle and part throttle. Having the ability to control the engine coolant temperature electronically results in improved emissions and fuel economy.
I had wondered if the drop in temp when I run through the gears harder than normal was just to make it easier on the engine during "spirited" driving.....cooler oil temps, less chance of detonation/pinging etc. Maybe that might actually be the case? :dunno
Comments anyone?
The Rock Auto parts catalog says OEM opening temp for our thermostats is 97C (206F). It's lower for my old Saturn (188/195F) and my minivan (170/180F). A 2010 Saturn Aura is spec'd at 180F. A 2011 Mustang V8 (or Focus 2.0L) is at 190F. 2011 BMW 328i (and the 1M turbo 6) also uses 97C. The 1998 BMW M3 calls for a 176F (80C) or 190F thermostat.
So newer BMWs like to run it hot and I'm guessing the others don't have a heater circuit so the computer can open it early. If we assume the DME can open a closed thermostat using the heater circuit but cannot close an open thermostat, then probably BMW spec'd a thermostat that opens at a higher temp than normal (maybe normal is 90C?) to give the DME more control.
If my thermostat is stuck open, will it hurt anything other than my gas mileage? Does running the engine at the proper temp more of the time mean better fuel economy and lower smog emissions without any tradeoffs? Or does higher coolant temp also mean less power?
Last winter I drove around with a T-stat stuck open and my gas mileage dropped significantly. I did not feel a loss of power (but mine is smaller than yours :))
That "heating the thermostat" business seems counter intuitive. But perhaps it allows for a smoother temperature control depending on how hard you pull on it and on exterior temp as well.
My last trip where I recorded data showed an engine coolant temp max of 192F ~ 89C. (March 15th 2012)
Here is some BMW info on the thermostat MAP:
http://wds.spaghetticoder.org/en/zin...1214_M0KFK.htm
Here is some data recorded with AutoEnginuity software from my 2003 330Ci that shows the operation of the MAP thermostat.
Blue is the oil temp
green is the coolant temp in the engine
orange is the coolant temp at the radiator outlet
red is the engine rpms
You can see when the load/rpms increase, the thermostat opens to cool the engine. The coolant temp at the radiator outlet increases with the higher flow.
I see this start normally around 3000 rpms under load.
I have the stewart water pump, original thermostat, original pulleys and I run Red Line Water Wetter.
I see about a 5-8 F degree drop in my coolant temps when running the water wetter. Not much.
http://forum.e46fanatics.com/attachm...5&d=1297364917
96 max, mostly around 94 with 80*F ambient
Great info! Thanks! So this confirms what I was thinking, running the engine harder opens the stat fully via the heater circuit.Quote:
Originally Posted by shanneba
I had been thinking of trying some water wetter, I think I'll have to get some. I'd much rather see 192 than the 205 I normally run. Maybe should have went with a Stewart when I did my cooling system overhaul.
Interesting to find out the temp range before the gauge actually moves....167 to 235F or 75 to 113C.
Thanks again.....Barry
Man, this is not your run-of-the-mill thermostat!
That would explain why when you pull on it, temperature drops a bit and seems to have nothing to do with air flow. Instead, it is the internal thermostat control that allows for dynamic control of engine temperature at different RMPs! Not a simple closed-open T-stat, more like 2 t-stat 2 different set points and a heating element on top of it! I'm amazed. Thanks for the info Shanneba.
Back to our regular schedule programing...
Oli77: 96
Dane: 97 (Won't give us the real number! )
Telijah: 88
edlvrt: 96
MrMaico: 97
Spencers: 90
Livesnearcoscto: 90 (Sounds about right?).
derbo: 95
GT172I: 96
shanneba: 89
I'll check mine again this afternoon, as I am now thinking I am closer to the lower 90s. I'll update later. I'll post both was OBC shows and what OBD shows, which hopefully reads from the same place.
Apparently, according to the last recorded run, even at 116 (km/h!), mine was running at 84 degrees...
Changed mine... 90-92C is my peak temp when idling. I'm really thinking of replacing the thermostat. I have an unused Wahler sitting at home, just feeling too lazy to jack up the front, remove the undertray and belt, drain some of the coolant, loosen the engine hoist hook, rebleed, etc. What happened to me? But I am expecting new rear coilover springs today. To install front springs I have to jack up the front anyway, so maybe I'll replace the thermostat then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oli77
I left that hoist hook off when I did my cooling system. Looks better without it sitcking out there and I don't have any plans of pulling my engine any time soon....I hope. :-)
hmmmm, the cooling surface area provided by that hook is now gone which may raise your engine temperature.
Oli77: 96
Dane: 97 (Won't give us the real number! )
Telijah: 88
edlvrt: 96
MrMaico: 97
Spencers: 90
Livesnearcostco: 91.
derbo: 95
GT172I: 96
shanneba: 89
Possibly, but that should be more than offset by the smoother airflow over the engine. :biggrinQuote:
Originally Posted by Oli77
True ;)
Why aren't more mafiosos pushing the knobs on their cluster to answer my little friendly gentle question?
Little tip, don't reach through the steering wheel to push the knob 27 times if you're at an intersection waiting to make a turn. Unless you have very fast hands or can stretch like Mr. Fantastic.
87 ... Then I turned on the heat and it started dropping all the way down to 81 then I reached my destination. Mixed city drive with brief highway short cut
Thank you sir.
Oli77: 96
Dane: 97 (Won't give us the real number! )
Telijah: 88
edlvrt: 96
MrMaico: 97
Spencers: 90
Livesnearcostco: 91.
derbo: 95
GT172I: 96
shanneba: 89
Hochspannung: 87
does this mean I'm in the lead so far since i have the lowest score haha?
Okay guys,
My numbers are super low. I peaked at around 76. I'm going to try to confirm my readings with my Scangauge, but at the moment it looks like I may be the victim of a stuck-open thermostat.
Yup. Your temp needle doesn't reach the middle?
i'll try tomorrow...but, honestly, my luck pressing that little knob has been rather hit/miss. it takes me forever to reset my oil/inspection shit.
That's like what I got if I stay on the freeway with outside temps in the 45F-55F range, peaked around 77C until I got to surface streets and stoplights.
For you other mafioso who were higher than 90C... did your coolant temps stay above 90C even on the freeway?
Quote:
Originally Posted by RITmusic2k
95
Sent from my outdated Droid X
Yes
Mine stays for the most part at 96. City or highway driving or outside air temp don't and shouldn't, make any difference. That's what your thermostat is supposed to do....maintain a constant temp. Or, if you're running the car harder, it should drop the temp a ways. I played around with that a bit last night and saw it drop down to as low as 87.Quote:
Originally Posted by LivesNearCostco
Also, of course, running the a/c with high ambient temps in the city or slow speed twisties will raise the temp some. I've seen mine as high as 100C in those conditions because at that point the cooling system has a hard time keeping up.
If you're running temps below the mid 90's, I'd have to wonder how well your stat is working.
I suspect this is Dane's problem as well. Unable-to-push-button-in-with-left-hand-itis.Quote:
Originally Posted by RVAzhp
Thanks Boss.Quote:
Originally Posted by kayger12
Perhaps yes, I would say the higher temperatures are present at a rate 3 times the lower temps.Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMaico
Oli77: 96
Dane: 97 (Won't give us the real number!:scratchinghead )
Telijah: 88
edlvrt: 96
MrMaico: 97
Spencers: 90
Livesnearcostco: 91.
derbo: 95
GT172I: 96
shanneba: 89
Hochspannung: 87
Kayger12: 95
Car has been kind of up and down with the rim issues I am having. Asking for grace here. I will get it done my friend. I will get it done.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oli77
I am been informed and will complete the task that's been assigned.
link me to your rim issue (i have missed it obviously).
Starts around post 2501.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oli77
http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showt...AD-***/page251
Original damage is below. They ran into is with another vehicle.
http://i1015.photobucket.com/albums/...6/IMAG1258.jpg
SheiBe
+1Quote:
Originally Posted by Oli77
HTC Thunderbolt+TT
95...all the way home from Norfolk.
HTC Thunderbolt+TT
You guys convinced me to replace my thermostat. If it makes me run a steady 95-96C on the freeway, maybe that will improve my gas mileage.
Right on the money! The weekend I checked mine via the dash it was reading 97C or 207F on the Garmin gauges rather than the usual 205 (96C) average reading. Since then it's been back to 205 that I normally see.....weird that it was reading those 2 degrees higher for a couple days.Quote:
Originally Posted by danewilson77
Thanks Boss.
Oli77: 96
Dane: 95
Telijah: 88
edlvrt: 96
MrMaico: 97
Spencers: 90
Livesnearcostco: 91.
derbo: 95
GT172I: 96
shanneba: 89
Hochspannung: 87
Kayger12: 95
Must....get.... more . . . . data
I'll try to remember to chip in tomorrow.
Update to my situation:
My car's not as misbehaved as I thought last time around; I must've just been getting some good cold air from somewhere. My temperature gauge does rise to its vertical position during normal driving -- I tried running the car hard and hot recently, and while idling / creeping in slow traffic, I got the reading up to 88°C, though it would quickly drop to the low 80s once I got to traffic speed. My scangauge confirmed 189°F coolant temperature. Close enough.