New ZHP and first manual transmission car

Hi all,

Im 28, from NYC but just moved to northern NJ. I just purchased a 2004 black on tan ZHP, slick top, 4 door, 6 speed. 191k miles with 2 owners. Definitely needs some work but I wanted something that I had to work on. I have always been into cars but having grown up in NYC it was extremely anti-car. Grew up poor and my parents could never afford a car, got one when I was in my 20s, a 2004 Audi A4 with the 3.0 V6 (auto), but eventually the street parking drove me crazy and I sold it.

I've always wanted to learn manual and learn to DIY on my own car, I'm not getting any younger so decided to leave the city and move to a place with a garage where I can keep it/work on it. Joined the forum to ask any DIY questions and hopefully link up with any members in the area who could show me a thing or two. Willing to shut up and listen.

I do have a question though, for those who learned manual after automatic, when did it click for you and become 'fun'? I just got the car and have maybe driven it a dozen times, but hill starts and starting from first/going slow still feel awkward, I still have to look down sometimes to know what gear I'm in and shifting smoothly/rev matching is pretty difficult. It just sort of feels like work and like I don't know how to drive haha. Especially in NJ traffic where everyone is mashing the gas in their 300+ HP SUVs, and they all want to slam their brakes and ride your bumper in stop-and-go traffic. I would love to get to the point where I'm rev matching every downshift and can pull away from first quickly, but driving manual just sort of gives me anxiety.

I do find the throw of the clutch unnecessarily long, so I ordered a clutch stop, will be doing a CDV delete, and I am also trying the mason engineering short throw clutch pedal.

I know it's early and I'm going to stick with it but just wondering when it clicked for anyone here.


REF

Welcome, man. You will love this forum. I learned how to drive on a car with MT. Let's see what others say about your question.

Please post pics of your ZHP when you have a free minute.

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Originally Posted by fredo

Welcome, man. You will love this forum. I learned how to drive on a car with MT. Let's see what others say about your question.

Please post pics of your ZHP when you have a free minute.

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Thank you! Here a few images I have

https://imgur.com/athtRYb

https://imgur.com/TF7eDvG

Attachment 38115

Yeah, I had about an hour of manual driving before I got mine because back in highschool I wanted to drive manual so badly that I paid a "manual driving school" $50 to try.

Honestly the ZHP isn't too bad - I didn't really stall, but was definitely hesitant at downshifting/rev-matching at first. So much so that I'd bog the engine down in gears higher than what was ideal. I also feel you with starting off, I was definitely slower with engaging the clutch and took a bit of time to set off at lights.

It'll just take time, and at least for me it's never perfect - I still get a rev-match once in a while that is ever so slightly off and the car jerks just a little, but overall it's quite fun and I love rev-match downshifting instead of using the brakes.

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Originally Posted by REF84

Thank you! Here a few images I have

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:like

I would say do not worry about getting any sort of mods regarding the clutch pedal or shifter. Get used to the stock stuff first. All that will come with time and practice and you'll get so used to it you won't even think twice about it. It does take time and regular practice.

Also, do not worry about rev-matching. For a beginning manual driver, that is the last thing you should worry about. It isn't necessary in these cars, even though it is fun and has benefits, but for now, just get used to starting off in first gear and hills.

You're not that far. I'm happy to help you refine and develop some skills if you'd like. I've taught several people how to drive manual and can show you some tricks, since we have the "same" car.

https://i.imgur.com/hainpTV.gif

The car looks great, and I'm loving that you're planning to wrench on it yourself! The E46 platform is so ubiquitous that there are basically DIY guides for everything, and there's at least one member on here that is active that has done one of those maintenance items, so you're in good hands.

Re: learning a manual transmission - I learned on manual transmissions when I got my learner's permit so I can't help you from that perspective. As a painful refrain like everyone else around here: it takes time. You said you've only taking it out for a spin about a dozen occasions and that really isn't that much experience.

Some tips that might help you:
Learn where the clutch engages. Go to a parking lot that's flat or has a very small uphill grade and just use the clutch to hold the car or get the car going without using the gas pedal. Repeat this multiple times, decreasing the time from when you let off the brake to when you hold/get the car moving, to get a feel for the clutch engagement point.
Sit in the car for five minutes and row the gears. Get familiar with the position of each gear. Do this a couple of times until it's more muscle memory.

The other stuff will just come with experience. Knowing the clutch engagement point, what gear your in, where to move the shift lever, etc all becomes second nature with enough seat time. Shifting smoothly is a life-long pursuit. The 1-2 shift is still the hardest for me and I'll flub it from time to time. I think it's down to the difference in revs vs. wheel speed so the margin of error is smaller compared to other gear shifts (I'm probably talking nonsense, but it's what I tell myself).

Also, driving a stick in stop-start traffic is work. It's not fun. If that's what I found myself driving in 95% of the time, I'd get sick of it too. But I specifically search out less crowded roads if I have to drive during rush hour, even if it'll add 10-15 mins of the commute.

As for the long shifter throws and long clutch pedal - yeah, you can change them. I left my clutch pedal alone aside from a CDV delete, but I got a short shifter from UUC. Short shifters are a must, IMO, but some people would argue otherwise. Your shifter could probably benefit from new shims at the very least, they've got some serious wear at your mileage which would clean up a lot of slop if present.

Congrats on the purchase of your ZHP, I happen to also live in north NJ and learned how to drive manual in my ZHP I picked up in march. Best advice that I can give is that don't worry about the aggressive ass drivers that we live with. The amount of times I stalled in the first week and "held up" traffic ive learned to ignore them and just focus on myself and my driving. The clutch pedal is a bit long i agree but like others have stated I would just get used to the car how she is and then decide if you wanna add to make the experience "better" by all means do so. Either way you will have a great time and turn lots of heads. PM me if you ever need anything at all I'm only about 20 min out from you. Excited about another New Jersey ZHP
owner!!

Welcome to the mafia!
Good answers about the clutch engagement point (leave parking brake on, don't push the accelerator and slowly release the clutch, you'll know when you hit it).
Learned to clutch a vehicle on a 50 cc Yamaha Enduro in France in 1978-79 and I remember exactly where I was.

Great intro/story and car, and of course, welcome to another NJ ZHP!

How do you spell manual-shifting skill? T-I-M-E. You'll get there. Just keep driving, keep thinking about little improvements here and there, and before you know it, when you drive someone else's automatic car, you'll be pushing a non-existent clutch and trying to grab the auto-lever-thing.

Before too long it becomes, ironically, an automatic process that your body just does. Kind of like playing an instrument or playing a sport. I've been driving manual transmission as my only option for 23 years, and there are still times when I grind a gear, stall, or fudge an up/downshift. That's part of what makes it fun.

Like BP said, keep it simple for now and then try more difficult stuff later on. A good entry point into rev-matching is to do it without braking whenever a downshift is needed, say on the highway. This helps you just worry about getting the engine to the proper range for the lower gear, and it's a safe-ish way to practice since you're not braking.

- mb

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Originally Posted by REF84

I do have a question though, for those who learned manual after automatic, when did it click for you and become 'fun'? I just got the car and have maybe driven it a dozen times, but hill starts and starting from first/going slow still feel awkward, I still have to look down sometimes to know what gear I'm in and shifting smoothly/rev matching is pretty difficult. It just sort of feels like work and like I don't know how to drive haha. Especially in NJ traffic where everyone is mashing the gas in their 300+ HP SUVs, and they all want to slam their brakes and ride your bumper in stop-and-go traffic. I would love to get to the point where I'm rev matching every downshift and can pull away from first quickly, but driving manual just sort of gives me anxiety.

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I will mirror everyone and say it comes with time. You're probably better off than where I started. I stalled out over and over in a parking lot. I think the problem was from just getting used to using my left leg to provide input.

A dozen drives is still pretty fresh, so things will be a bit awkward. But focus on the basics first and then you can do rev-matching. Definitely get a feel for starting in 1st and where each gear is. I think the easiest rev-match to start with is the fourth to third gear shift when coming to a stoplight or similar situation, as you just have to move the knob forward and only have to increase the revs a small bit at the usual speeds.

Thank you all for the responses! What a great community

Seems like the common response is to just give it some more time. I'm still getting used to the bite point everyday, feels like it's right at the top of the pedal which makes it a little less forgiving to me. I did order and install the bimmerworld "puck" clutch stop and it made quite a difference though, even screwed in at it's lowest position. I have taken her out a few times and I am already getting more used to finding the gears and being quicker with the shifts, I'm not letting the revs drop much at all for upshifts. Also learned to hold the bite point a little for downshifts to let the engine speed up so the shift is smoother. Have to experiment with the seating position because my leg is sort of in the air when at the bite point. But I think with time I really will get it. I revved it to 6k and did a quick 1-2 shift and 2-3 shift and I said "okay now that's pretty fun" lol. I tend to creep with just the clutch first without using gas but I'm starting to add more gas now as well. Pulling into my garage slowly is still a little nerve racking since it has a small ramp and I'm trying not to go in with too much speed.

I also did a couple of 6 > 5 rev matches on the freeway, didn't get them perfect but I could definitely feel that the clutch barely had to do any work to complete the downshift.


I'm filling up my FCP Euro cart with some parts now to do some maintenance, have been watching the popular stuff on youtube (ShoplifeTV, 50sKid). So far did an oil change, new battery, brake fluid, straightened my front 2 rims and purge valve for CEL.

Here is a list of the things I'm thinking of doing now:

Steering guibo/coupler (I have a ton of play in the steering wheel on center, like 1.5 inches either side, get a ton of bump steer)
Window regulators (My passenger rear down is stuck down after the guy at the inspection station rolled it down for some reason)
cabin/intake air filters (both filthy)
New tires (current ones are from 2013, and have cracks on the inside, thinking of going with the Pilot Sport AS4 or DWS06+)
Manual Transmission Fluid
Differential Fluid
Power Steering Fluid (May need new cap and gasket as well, has some gunk on top)


Unfortunately I do not know if the cooling system was done, so I think I may have to do that soon. Oil filter housing gasket is also leaking oil so need to do that as well, might as well do with cooling system. There looks to be some fraying on the drive belts so have to do those soon also, should I do the pulleys as well? I have no maintenance records on this car unfortunately so I'm kind of just guessing.

Two other issues I'm having:

Rear windshield is very blurry/murky looking. Almost as if there is a film on it that has melted. Visibility is quite poor. Any idea what this is?
Passenger headlight has condensation in the turn signal, do I just take it apart and clean it, and perhaps replace the headlight gasket?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by REF84

Seems like the common response is to just give it some more time. I'm still getting used to the bite point everyday, feels like it's right at the top of the pedal which makes it a little less forgiving to me. I did order and install the bimmerworld "puck" clutch stop and it made quite a difference though, even screwed in at it's lowest position. I have taken her out a few times and I am already getting more used to finding the gears and being quicker with the shifts, I'm not letting the revs drop much at all for upshifts. Also learned to hold the bite point a little for downshifts to let the engine speed up so the shift is smoother. Have to experiment with the seating position because my leg is sort of in the air when at the bite point. But I think with time I really will get it. I revved it to 6k and did a quick 1-2 shift and 2-3 shift and I said "okay now that's pretty fun" lol. I tend to creep with just the clutch first without using gas but I'm starting to add more gas now as well. Pulling into my garage slowly is still a little nerve racking since it has a small ramp and I'm trying not to go in with too much speed.

I also did a couple of 6 > 5 rev matches on the freeway, didn't get them perfect but I could definitely feel that the clutch barely had to do any work to complete the downshift.

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Yeah, the clutch engages high on the pedal travel. You really could be quick and just kind of stab it, but I enjoy the full pedal travel to shift. This is mainly because our engine doesn't rev very quickly, so some delay is necessary to let the revs drop and smoothly shift, and doing something during that delay (full in-out engagement of the clutch pedal) helps with timing for me.

Holding the engagement point with the clutch pedal on downshifts will change when you become more familiar with rev-matching and some good ol' heel and toe. I forced myself to heel-and-toe on every downshift, even when just puttering around and it helped me learn the engine pretty well. I also fuck around with left foot braking so maybe don't listen to me.

And yeah, when you let the car stretch its legs all the way up to 6800 RPMs, it's where the fun is.

Sounds like you're on your way to making it second nature and having fun with the car itself.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by REF84

I'm filling up my FCP Euro cart with some parts now to do some maintenance, have been watching the popular stuff on youtube (ShoplifeTV, 50sKid). So far did an oil change, new battery, brake fluid, straightened my front 2 rims and purge valve for CEL.

Here is a list of the things I'm thinking of doing now:

Steering guibo/coupler (I have a ton of play in the steering wheel on center, like 1.5 inches either side, get a ton of bump steer)
Window regulators (My passenger rear down is stuck down after the guy at the inspection station rolled it down for some reason)
cabin/intake air filters (both filthy)
New tires (current ones are from 2013, and have cracks on the inside, thinking of going with the Pilot Sport AS4 or DWS06+)
Manual Transmission Fluid
Differential Fluid
Power Steering Fluid (May need new cap and gasket as well, has some gunk on top)


Unfortunately I do not know if the cooling system was done, so I think I may have to do that soon. Oil filter housing gasket is also leaking oil so need to do that as well, might as well do with cooling system. There looks to be some fraying on the drive belts so have to do those soon also, should I do the pulleys as well? I have no maintenance records on this car unfortunately so I'm kind of just guessing.

Two other issues I'm having:

Rear windshield is very blurry/murky looking. Almost as if there is a film on it that has melted. Visibility is quite poor. Any idea what this is?
Passenger headlight has condensation in the turn signal, do I just take it apart and clean it, and perhaps replace the headlight gasket?

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Sounds like you've done some good maintenance and have appropriate stuff planned.

I would do the cooling system if the parts look all BMW and old (kind of tough to tell). It's really not bad if you have the proper tools, time, and space.

The power steering reservoir has a release/leak area so sometimes it can leak and that's normal.

Definitely do the pulleys as well while you're in there. They're surprisingly cheap, and very easy to do with everything off.

Does the rear windshield have a tint on it of some sort? The glass itself shouldn't warp or be blurry on its own.

The passenger headlight probably has a worn gasket. Luckily for you, sedans are easy to replace the lens and the gasket for not too much money.

My 2009 335i had very few service recs. I stopped by a shop mentioned in the carfax report and they printed some recs for me. Maybe you can do the same ? It's worth to try. Those receipts were around $4,000 so I was happy to get them.

I needed to replace both front turn signals because water was getting inside. Sounds like you have the same issue. These are the PNs for both turn signals:

63-13-7-165-859 Left directional indicator
63-13-7-165-860 Right directional indicator

Maybe you can ask at a tint shop if they can clean the rear windshield for you.

Welcome and congrats on the car.

Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk

Welcome.

Honestly, I thought it was easy to pick up. For me, it didn't become fun until I started trying out various things. I started out just getting the basics down so didn't rev-match or anything like that until after. It was too much to juggle all at once. Once you get used to just doing smooth upshifts, then start playing around with the rest of the stuff and that becomes fun. Mainly cause you're not too focused on the easy stuff.