Gents,
Another question for today: I'm getting ready to replace some cooling system parts. I'll probably buy one of those kits that includes the water pump, hoses, expansion tank, etc. Some questions:
- What's the recommendation on the water pump in terms of brand. Ok to buy OE or OEM? Or just suck it up and buy the BMW one?
- Same question above re: expansion tank
Anything else to replace while I'm doing the cooling system parts? I do plan to do the Vanos seals.
My ZHP has 98K now.
For cooling system parts, I buy only BMW parts but that’s just me.
I would at least replace the following -
Water pump
Thermostat
Upper and lower hose
Expansion tank
thermocouple in the lower hose
But I would also replace the hoses going from expansion tank to the cabin and the engine block and the pipes under the intake manifold just based on age.
Some folks here may recommend Stewart water pump but I don’t see the appeal but something for you to consider.
In addition, if the belts and tensioners were never replaced, I would definitely replace them also.
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San,
Thanks for the detailed reply, much appreciated.
Oil Filter Housing Gasket
CVV/Oil Separator
Include the hoses underneath the air intake (intake off job), and get a replacement gasket while in there.
There are some sensors you could replace, coolant temp and pressure I believe...
Good time to do spark plugs and coils.
F_C, thanks for the addition to the list. The Oil filter housing gasket plugs and coils were done at 80k-ish...as for the sensors, i'd have to look at the records again.
And yes, everybody loves fried chicken!
Update: Been researching best parts kits for me and a la carte pricing others. While all of this has been going on, my ZHP sprung a leak and you guessed it, it was the expansion tank. I haven't been driving it for about a week now and finally got around to adding some green dye to the coolant. Started it up, ran the heater, then the AC, and sure enough I saw the green dye beneath the expansion tank. I then removed the air box to see exactly where the leak is and saw that the side had a thin hairline crack on the side of the ET.
I need to save up for the parts...damn the cost of genuine BMW parts are no joke lol. I did buy the genuine BMW ET kit w/ a brass bleeder screw from FCP and an o-ring kit from a reputable eBay seller. I can't swing the entire cost of the cooling hose system kit this month so replacing the ET and the hose o-rings will be the fix for the immediate future.
https://i.imgur.com/tML3OwAm.jpg
I detailed every cooling system part I replaced in my build thread when I did a complete cooling system overhaul on my ZHP last year. It was pricy because I used Genuine OEM BMW parts and the Stewart water pump when I did mine.
I was considering the brass bleeder but read of issues with the metal & plastic parts not playing nice together. I did get the lower-pressure cap & don't overfill the tank to help keep the pressure from getting too high.Quote:
Originally Posted by TXRedDevil
Bleeder screws fail because they are overtightened and that causing them to stretch and then adding heat pops the head off. I've probably installed thousands of plastic bleeder screws, if they are fresh I reuse, if they are unknown age then I replace. Never had one fail.
Waterpump, I use BMW.
cak: I'll find it and check it out. Thanks!Quote:
Originally Posted by cakM3
+1Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeH
I’ve installed only a few plastic bleeder screws and never had any issues.
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George,Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeH
Great insight, thank you. Seems to me and from what I researched, it's best to replace w/ genuine BMW parts.
Absolutely :thumbsupQuote:
Originally Posted by TXRedDevil
Quote:
Originally Posted by TXRedDevil
DittoQuote:
Originally Posted by cakM3
Help needed!
What an eventful weekend. Started out my Friday and a few hours on Saturday to change out the lines that are attached to the PS reservoir and the one that attaches to the rack. Started the bleeding procedure and then about halfway in, one of the hoses that I apparently didn’t crimp well enough popped off. I had covered the alternator with a garbage bag but fluid still soaked it. No problems starting and hope the residual fluid runs out. So one maintenance item done.
Now onto the cooling system: against my better judgement and probably conventional wisdom, im l only replacing the expansion tank and all but one line leading from it. I’m not replacing that long one that goes to the firewall. All others are being replaced. I managed to get that engine block coolant drain plug using a combo of extensions and swiveling head ratchet wrench. Got soaked as I’m sure everyone has. Since I put that leak detection dye in, I plan to flush with distilled water. All drains were opened and pretty confident the bulk of the coolant has been drained.
But I’m stuck! Now I probably spent a few hours between the keyboard and my ET trying to get that bastard in. The bracket is original BMW. So was the ET. I bought a genuine BMW ET like you guys advised. It was not difficult to get it out from underneath: I took a piece of pine (5” long) and gave it a good smack. It came undone pretty easily. However I can’t get the new one in! First I tried muscle-ing it in. Then a little Vaseline. Then I put that same piece of pine on top of the top of the ET and gave it a firm but not barbarian smack. All it did was sliglhty deform the inner lip, which now I’m worried will cause a leak :( I’ll post a pic later.
I plan on removing the long vert local bracket and seeing if I can get the ET back on without busting the flimsy bottom mount. I tell you, what a poor design. Gripes aside, do y'all have any advice o. How to get this on wi th out breaking it? Also could it be that the design changed?
Other questions:
- does anyone know the part number of the drain plug crush washer?
- if I remove and reuse hoses, do yall recommend to replace the o-rings?
- so what I understand is that when you snap in hose fittings, the metal clip must be in the locked position. Is the same true for the expansion tank?
Hey all, it’s been a long time since I’ve posted anything on this forum. It’s good to be back!
Here’s my two cents worth on cooling system parts. Go OEM and nothing else. The first time I did the water pump, expansion tank, hoses etc. I went aftermarket with the cheapest parts I could find at the time. I had heckuva time trying to get parts to fit . The next time, I went all OEM from ECS Tuning and got a full cooling system refresh including radiator. Everything fit together perfectly. Also, the aftermarket water pump failed on me when I thought the “upgraded“ metal impeller design would be superior. Somehow the metal repeller came apart and got ingested into the cooling system. I got some parts of it out, but some are never to be seen again.
To summarize, go OEM, especially for critical parts whenever you possibly can. It will be worth it in the long run.
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Johnny,
Used to be your neighbor (Concord) for 5 years before moving out to TX! Hope all is well in CA for you..
Thanks for chiming in. I got the oem expansion tank; i was worried about fitment and unfortunately it's not working for me. Hence the follow up post. This thing don't wanna cooperate and seat.
Sometimes they can be tough if you are not experienced installing them and sometimes they just fall together. You are not alone in that I've two times recently had DIY'ers struggle for hours with multiple sets of hands and they can't get it, then I walk over and it pops together.
I use silicone spray on the bottom and then line everything up and wiggle as I push down, never had an issue.
I would be worried about what lip you deformed as well, post a pic?
George,
Appreciate the reply. I'll give silicone spray a go, but i'm going to remove the bracket tonight and try the silicone spray. Thanks for the suggestion. Here's a pic of the deformation. It's minor, but I'm concerned that it's minor enough to cause a leakage. I may take some 1200 grit sandpaper to.
Once I get it on, I'm going to pour distilled water into the system and pressure test it (pressure testing kit arriving latest Wednesday) to flush out the old coolant w/ dye and of course, pressure test the system:
https://i.imgur.com/B4U62sGh.jpg
Hey there!!! Yeah, things in California suck. But I’m stuck here for a while due to family. TX is on my short list to escape to. TN and AZ are up there too. If you don’t mind me asking, where in Tx?Quote:
Originally Posted by TXRedDevil
As for the expansion tank, did you get the hook shaped tab seated into the slot correctly? Also, from the picture of the damage to the inside of the ET, you may have already gotten it seated? I can’t quite tell though. If that metal clip clips into place and the ET won’t come back up, you should be good to go.
When I did my cooling system the 2nd time, I was shocked at how easily everything came together. There was a snug little soft click into place. But it’s been a while since I did it. Hopefully others with more experience can chime in.
Hope you can get things sorted out quickly with no leaks. These things can be a royal headache.
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OP-Check out the YT video from 50’s Kid if you haven’t already. It’s called the E46 Radiator and Coolant Expansion Tank Replacement video. From about 24 minute mark, he pops in the new ET and it looks really loose, but the clip and everything else snugged into place.
He also takes off the bracket for the radiator so you can get a better idea of how everything else fits together.
Hope this helps.
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Gents,
Mission freakin' accomplished!
Thanks for all the help and friendly advice. So I ended up taking off the bracket and it wasn't too bad getting it off. If I had to do it a second time, I'd partially unscrew the fan shroud off too to give myself more wiggle room to get the bracket off. The hardest part though was getting off a one-time use fastener at the top left hand corner of the fan shroud, which holds the bracket to it. If it was meant to pull off, I broke it lol. So I pulled it out far enough and then took a coping saw and cut it off to get the bracket off. I'll have to buy a replacement one.
Putting it on the bench was much much easier. I could control pressure on both ends while snapping it into place. Plus, I used more lube on the female and male ends of the ET and bracket ends than I ever did in all my years of marriage. Ok, more than last time :)
The other hard part was wiggling the bracket with the ET on it back into place along w/ the fan shroud.
Oh, so I was simultaneously researching how to bleed air out of the system and in my 4Runner forum, one of the guys swears by this device called a Lisle Spill-free funnel, which basically burps air out of your system while filling it up. There's nothing more annoying than bleeding air out of your cooling system. I'm eager to give it a go. This'll be arriving tomorrow and the pressure tester on Wednesday. Vid link. I'll let you gents know how it goes.
One question: I'd add and circulate 2 gallons of clean distilled water through my cooling system to get out as much as that coolant leak dye out of the system. Do y'all think it's worth the effort? Or will 2 gals of Zerex dilute the dye so much that it wouldn't matter? Opinions and advice welcome.
Congrats!!! I know how frustrating things can be, been there many times myself. I’d say the coolant system burping thing should work out good. I never used one myself, but have seen many.
What year/model 4Runner do you have? I have a 2021 Off Road Premium in metallic black. Nicknamed Max. So far, we have about 18k miles on it. We had a 2000 4Runner that we sold at 200k+ miles.
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Is the dye safe for cooling systems? If so, I'd leave it.
For bleeding, the internet is full of ways to do this, but I've done it basically one way for almost 20yrs without issue.
I remove the bleeder screw and fill until it comes out of the bleeder screw. I reinstall the screw and continue filling until absolutely full. Install the cap and warm the car to operating temp (so the thermostat fully opens and you get coolant flow through the rad) with the heater on. Let it cool down to cold and adjust the level as needed (99/100 times I have to add).
I still have a '98! Has about 278K. What a freakin' champ the 4Runner is. It refuses to die and the repairs/maintenance have been very miniscule. It still has the original factory radiator. Water pump has been replaced twice. The original lasted about 150K miles (guesstimating).
George,
Thanks fore the advice. I'm pretty certain that the dye is safe. It's this brand: Tracer
Mine ZHP is a manual, so are you talking about the blue bleeder screw that's right underneath the expansion tank?
Hey Tx! I think he’s talking about the bleeder screw up top next to the ET and air box. It’s part of the upper hose. It’s plastic so be careful with it. It doesn’t take much force. Just a good snug.Quote:
Originally Posted by TXRedDevil
Thumbs up on your 98! In some ways I miss our old 4Runner.
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Ah sorry, my mind has been so focused on bleeding that i read that too fast. Yes, just a little snug as you and others have said. I bought a brass screw too as some have recommended while others have said plastic is fine.Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyGraphic
If the Lisle contraption doesn't work, I'll give the other method that George does.
(Mostly) Success!
For other newbies like myself, I'm going to document things I learned along the way on the power steering pump and cooling system fluid draining, filling, and bleeding.
Power steering reservoir and steering hoses notes
- To recap, I needed change my PS suction hose due to a leak at the top of the hose. Given that I was going to change that hose, I decided to change the return hose at the same time. Which led to another decision to change the pressure hose as well since it sits in the same place as the
return hose. To remove the pressure and return hoses, I bought the Lisle fuel and AC Disconnect pliers from FCP. A good investment because it make taking off those hose fittings a breeze. FCP part number LIS-37300
Filling/bleeding- This is where things went south. After draining as much as possible from the reservoir and the hoses that I replaced, I poured in the fluid and did lock-to-lock turning of the steering wheel. 10 times, then go to the reservoir and add a little more fluid. I really do not know what happened but at some point the steering wheel became harder to turn. So I sort of muscled it and then i heard a loud pop. I think what happened was this: my floor jack was sorta by the front tire. I think somehow it might've gotten underneath one of the tires, hence the steering wheel getting somewhat jammed. When I was able to turn the wheel, I think there was too much pressure which forced the hose to pop off. After cleaning and cursing, I had to do it all over again.
Use factory clamps- Related to the above, I bought aftermarket hose clamps and used it on the leaky PS hose. What a damn mistake. The hose came with a worm gear type screw on clamp, but I opted to go with the crimp style. Hence the advice to put a towel on top of the alternator. Right now the PS fluid is slowly leaking out of the alternator, but i'm pretty sure that alternator will live a shorter life. I hope i didn't blow seals.. Edit: 3 days later, it's still slow dripping. I sprayed electrical contact cleaner in there to dilute it, but it's still slow dripping.
Cover that alternator w/ plastic and a terry towel or something absorbent! Here you see the right worm gear-type clamp I should've just used from the get go.
Burping the air out of the PS system consisted of lock-to-lock steering, but i also massaged the lines that produced bubbles. Because I messed up above, I was a bit agitated so I mildly slammed the door out of frustration. Well lo and behold, that door slamming resulted in a lot of bubbles coming out lol. Don't go ape shit, but a nice firm close of the door produces air to release out of the system.
It took a few tries. I think I did this about 5 times before I didn't see bubbles. Remember, don't overfill. The cap's stem has 3 segments. I have read that it should be right in the middle when cold.
Oh, I used Redline D4 ATF. I must've read pages and pages of back-n-forth and went with Redline. The nice thing too is that the manual transmission takes the same fluid, so next time around I'm gonna change both at the same time by purchasing 3 bottles, which will cover them both.
Cooling system
The main reason I was doing all this work is because the expansion tank cracked. See my notes above. Draining is pretty simple on this car. There's blue cap drain plugs underneath the ET and radiator. Also, there's a coolant return hose that is connected to the ET. These are the easiest ones to remove. I used a angled pick to get the hose clips unseated. I used a flat bladed screw driver or a small pry bar with gentle persuasion to get the hoses off.
As for the ET, all my self-induced drama is documented above. I did replace the upper radiator hose too. Removing it was a bear. I ended up using a small pry bar with gentle pressure.
Unbolting the engine drain block was not as challenging as some wrote. I used two 6" extensions on a swivel head for the 13mm socket. It was not difficult to remove. Make sure you use a replacement aluminum crush washer. It's an M14 x 18 x 1.5. None of the big box stores had this size so you'll have to order from your online BMW store. And yes, you're gonna get wet. I had a rectangular container to catch as much as possible. I did it twice during my flushing w/ distilled water. Next time around: a) devise some sort of large tube (I've read some ppl using down spout hoses), b) Buy a new bolt (this one is sorta deformed at the corners), and of course have the right sized aluminum washer (gasket) on hand.
On another mental midget note, I totally forgot I had a stubby ratchet.
I have one similar to this one. I noticed a little weeping from the drain block plug, so I cleaned it off and sprayed it w/ brake cleaner. Came back and a wee bit of weeping. So I used the stubby ratchet w/ the 13mm socket, tightened it down, and cleaned/sprayed it again. Came back 10 mins later and no weeping. In the future, I'm going to use it vs the combo of extensions, etc. that I used the first time around. This was the only bolt I didn't torque down to spec due to space reasons.
Since the e46 community has put the fear of God in me about the cooling system, i bought a pressure testing kit. It worked well enough. I bought it because the manual online clearly said they had a fitting for both the e46 and my 4runner. The Bentley manual i'm told says no more than 21 psi, but I could only pump it to 18. This didn't bother me too much because the kit said not to exceed 20 or be under 15. The drop rate should be 1 psi per 2 mins. It held per instructions and most importantly, I didn't see any leaks. Pic below. Brand name is humorous.
https://i.imgur.com/XuiowOt.jpg
Filling and bleeding: I also bought a Lisle cooling tank bleeder contraption. Here's the kit and what it comes with. The black fitting is missing because it's the one that fits our e46s:
https://i.imgur.com/oxkkazG.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/hZvT8Be.jpg
Let me tell you it works and it's pretty hands free, though I wouldn't walk away from it due to possible overheating. With the front elevated, I used the proper fitting and put the big funnel on top. Poured in 1 gallon and watched it do its thing. It was a few minutes before the heater core /thermostat engaged and then the coolant in the funnel started to go down so I added more coolant in it. You want to keep it about 1/3 - 1/2 full, so have your coolant ready. I had to let the engine cool down at some point, so I repeated this over 3 nights. Also, when the engine cools down, there will be a contraction and the fluid in the funnel will go down very rapidly. I was not ready the first time. The second time around I was ready to add coolant. I retired for the night after that and repeated for 2 more nights. And yes, I used the firm door closing technique to good effect.
Even when it's being worked on, it sure is purdy:
https://i.imgur.com/4OaSKR3.jpg.
As you can see, the green dye I put in is still visible in the new blue coolant, but the flush did get the majority of it out.
I just took it out for a drive---the company let us out early so why not. Turned on the heater to 91F again and drove around the neighborhood. Success- the heat was coming out with gusto and the temp was sitting at the half mark. Decided to take her on the highway and gun it a few times. All good :)
Edit: Stretched the Devil's legs out for it's first freeway trip to our local Korean market after all the work for some Christmas day Surf n Turf dinner for the wifey. We had a very simple and chill Christmas dinner alone (yay).
Grocery getter today:
https://i.imgur.com/G0ydHDX.jpg
Christmas dinner for two:
https://i.imgur.com/IQh42c0.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/zaQ7wR3.jpg
This is Chinese okra sauteed w/ garlic, olive oil, and a little water. Really healthy and tastes great. Very common Taiwanese dish.
https://i.imgur.com/O5A779C.jpg
OTHER:
- Next major repair is the Vanos and I'll add more new oil after it's fixed as the oil is 1 years old now on 1K of driving (previous owner).
- I changed out the manual tranny fluid with Redline D4 ATF. That crappy notch shifting in 1st is all but gone. This was a big win for me. I hated that notchy shifting.
Great job on all of the work!
Looking forward to the photos.
Hi Buddy! Glad to hear everything is buttoned up and you're done with all of that. Congratz! Good solid advice above too. I thought that when you said you slammed your door that the window broke! Yikes! That would've really sucked.
I had to replace my alternator 15k miles ago (2017) since my PS reservoir was leaking into it. It didn't look too bad, but it must've been enough to kill it. So, I replaced it along with the PS reservoir/pump/lines. I used the worm gear style of clamp. After a little while, I went back in there and tightened them up a bit since they came loose. I tried to go cheap when removing the PS lines. What a mistake. I finally gave up and bought the hose removal tool at the local autozone and it came off in 10 seconds! Totally worth it's weight in gold!
I redid the VANOS seals early on at 90k miles back in 2011. I used the Beisan vanos seal kit. I took my time and it is still going strong today.
Congratz again on a job well done & happy motoring!!!
Johnny,
Wouldn't it be cool if someone would invent/create or 3D print some sort of diverter guard that shields the alternator from weepy PS fluid from that problematic hose? :)
Yes, Beisan seems to be the one that everyone goes with. However, Race German has a complete kit. Are they vastly different in quality? Objectively speaking, $60 for Beisan o-rings...are they made with gold powder? Seriously, I get that they're the first ones to make the kit (based on what I read), but $60 for an o-ring set defies common sense to me.
Did you replace the solenoid too?
Beisan
https://i.imgur.com/kiaB2cjl.jpg
Race German
https://i.imgur.com/ieby81wl.jpg
Hey TX-I only bought the seals from Beisan. I haven't touched the solenoids though. As far as I know, they're not causing any issues. I did replace the metal VANOS gasket, the valve cover and spark plug gaskets at the same time though. You have to pull all of that apart anyways, so good time to do it.
I think you're supposed to replace the VANOS fit bolts (they're LH thread) along with the copper crush washers for the oil line.
Back when I did it, there weren't any YT videos floating around the internets, so I used a step by step on either the e46fanatics or bimmerfest forums I think. I'm sure YT is flooded with how-to videos and they'll have other suggestions. I did mine about 12 years ago now.
That Race German kit looks good, especially since they include just about everything you need to rebuild the VANOS unit. That's the first I've heard of that company, so hopefully more experienced minds will chime in on this.
Johnny,
Appreciate the reply. You answered a question I had as well: what else while I'm in there? Ok, got it on the bolts, valve cover gasket, and spark plug gasket. The other one is the vanos oil line many others have said to replace. Looks like the German kit has the copper crush washers.
I took a longer drive today to the other side of north Dallas to help my wife take care of some business and have lunch w/ friends. Total miles = 70-80 ish. With all that I've done so far (diff, manual trans, oil, p/s fluid, coolant, and DISA rehab), it drives much nicer than before. The DISA has had the most impact on the fluttering / stumbling acceleration and I'm hoping that the Vanos rehab will take care of the issue for good. It's annoying, but takes nothing away from the joy of driving this car esp. on the highways.
You nailed one of the biggest reasons why I love this thing. Whenever I'm stretching it's legs on the highway, the smiles return and all of the junk we put up with due to it being a tempermental German car disappears. All of the around town driving is like being in a straightjacket.Quote:
Originally Posted by TXRedDevil
One thing I forgot to mention on the VANOS is to put a lot of towels or a plastic bag under the VANOS when you remove it since it will gush oil when you least expect it.
Also, I realized I forgot to answer your other question in the other post, it would be GREAT if BMW designed a PS system that didn't leak! Hahaha! But I digress.