Materials to Maintain Your ZHP IIIII Hand Protection IIIII Tools to Maintain Your ZHP
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Amazon Link for ZHPMafia ZHP
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  1. #31
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
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    San Francisco, CA
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    6,846


    The camera is catching the GruppeM intake noise more than anything.


    Dane, it does lose the air from the grille but it does get air from the bottom below the headlight.

    http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=653046


    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoStu View Post
    I've noticed in recent years that the GruppeM intake has had a pretty bad rep around the forums, especially amongst some of our newer members (2007+). I think this is due to it's high price and the common misconception of how the intake actually works. Also note that replica GruppeM intakes aren't true replicas in the fact that the heat shields have different shapes. I had my car apart today while I was replacing my thermostat and water pump, so I decided to take some pictures to illustrate how the GruppeM works.

    This is the GruppeM intake installed. I believe many people have based their opinion on this intake purely off what they see in this picture. An intake snorkel that goes nowhere and a heat shield stuck up against the backside of the headlight, yuck!




    This is the intake in it's raw. It is specifically designed to scoop cool air and block heat from the alternator and engine. The heat shield on mine is made of carbon kevlar. Take note of the shape of the heat shield.





    This is the area where the intake will be installed. I've labeled some key components in the picture to help get an idea of where things are in relation to the intake. The alternator and expansion tank can become quite hot when the engine is at full operating temperature.




    This is the intake after it has been properly installed. The alternator and expansion tank have been completely covered by the heat shield. The filter on the intake also has plenty of surface area. Also note how low the intake actually sits.




    Here is another picture of the intake installed. I've highlighted the area in blue of where the air is actually supplied from. This is a rather large opening that feeds down to the bumper, right where the brake duct and fog light sit. Notice how the heat shield sits nicely against this opening. This same opening is used by intakes such as Dinan, Benfer, etc that take their air from the same location.



    Here is a bird's eye view of the opening. I've labeled the fog light and brake duct to give you an idea of where this opening actually leads to. Plenty of cool air is provided by this area. It's common for people with the GruppeM to actually cut a small portion off of the top of their brake duct to supply additional cool air.




    This picture goes back to the intake snorkel that goes nowhere. While it may lead nowhere, it is actually acting as a "cooling fan" for the intake's heat shield. Heat shields can actually absorb a lot of heat. This cooling method helps to keep temperatures down.




    That's all I have. I hope after reading this it has shed some light on how this intake actually works. A common misconception is that the air is take from the back of the headlight. As illustrated in the preceding pictures, the air is taken from the lower part of the bumper, same location that the Dinan, and like intakes, take their air from.

    You might be asking yourself, "why does he care so much?", and the answer is, I really don't care. I just think a lot of false information goes around this forum. Years ago the GruppeM was regarded as a great intake and loved by most. In the snap of the finger, nowadays it seems people have nothing but negative things to say.

    Feel free to discuss. Comments both positive and negative are welcome.


    Additional Info:

    GruppeM Dyno:
    http://forum.e46fanatics.com/attachm...7&d=1051068218

    http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=24845

  2. #32
    Crestwood1001 Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by derbo View Post


    The camera is catching the GruppeM intake noise more than anything.


    Dane, it does lose the air from the grille but it does get air from the bottom below the headlight.

    http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=653046
    That's a sin to have such a nice intake in such a dirty engine bay

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    The Windy City
    Posts
    9,155
    Quote Originally Posted by Hornung418 View Post
    Have you opened the stock air box? Where are these magical 90 degree bends hiding? All that's there is a smooth flowing stack that leads right into the MAF.

    A true CAI is easily attainable for under $150. All you need is a quality dry air filter some hose clamps and a nice piece of 3" silicone tubing with a 60 degree bend.

    Heat shielding does nothing to alter the temperature of the intake air on this set up. Money saved.

    But what about hydrolocking?! Wat.

    Water getting into the intake and making its way to the cylinder and actually being enough of it to brake something in the engine is extremely unlikely. You'd have to drive into a sink hole and if you do lock the engine, that's the least of your worries.

    Why pay for something that doesn't work? Makes no sense to me.

    Horney...via TT.
    The bends I was referring to are from grilles to filter.

    Hydro locking could be a concern however I'll point out that I've never had an issue in the 10 years I've owned cars with ram intakes on them as well as the fact that ive never met anyone else oit there in the world who's had it, let alone with this intake.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending it cuz I have one or spent money on one... It was free and came with the car.

    It's style mixed with function. Dyno proven gains over stock air box. Plus it's all CF and looks good under the bonnet. You pay the price to get both in 1 package.




    - Goin' H.A.M. Mobile
    Call me Seth
    CURRENT: 2016 Long Beach Blue BMW /// M2
    RETIRED: ‘15 F22 M235i | '08 E90 M3 DCT "GoinHAM3" | '04 E46 M3 6MT "WEGOHAM"
    '04 330i ZHP | '11 E82 135i | '08 E90 328xi | 07 E91 328xi SportWagon

    Quote Originally Posted by danewilson77 View Post
    If I wore panties, I'd be dropping them right now.

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    San Francisco, CA
    Posts
    6,846
    I bought one under $300 and I say its sounds fantastic. I didn't get the intake for HP, i got it for noise so i could hear the car during track days. If I wanted power, that would be in a supercharger/turbo. )

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Chapel Hill, NC
    Posts
    2,292
    Pants are tight again! Thanks for the info Derek! I'll try and read through that thread tomorrow when I don't have Dynamics hw due haha
    -Chris-

    2003 ZHP Sedan - Jet Black on Sand - SOLD

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
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    6,940
    It's not about where the air comes from, it's how it gets read by the MAF. And an open filter attached directly to the MAF is doing nothing to help your readings thus negatively affecting performance.

    Horney...via TT.
    Porsche 944 Turbo Build

    One ride and you'll understand why most rocket scientists are German.

    My ZHP Build 2004-2014 RIP


  7. #37
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
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    San Francisco, CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hornung418 View Post
    It's not about where the air comes from, it's how it gets read by the MAF. And an open filter attached directly to the MAF is doing nothing to help your readings thus negatively affecting performance.

    Horney...via TT.
    What does an open air filter do to the MAF? I'm curious.

    My impression how an MAF sensor (hot wire) works is that a wire with electrical current in it is placed in the flow of the intake. That wire is subjected to air flow and changes the wire's temperature which affects how it adjusts the current to reach the ideal temperature. The circuit that detects the changes is then sent to the DME. I'm not an expert so that's all how I thought it worked.

    I'm guessing the open air filter slapped onto the MAF doesn't provide the proper laminar flow required for an accurate reading.

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
    Posts
    6,940
    Precisely. The long tube provides the flow necessary to allow for accurate readings while increasing volume.

    THIS THREAD highlights the main differences between intakes, and while its an import magazine, the science is still there and by a reputable individual as well.

    Don't mind Carcus, he's a huge douche. Dare I say it, a bigger one than Iceman....

    Horney...via TT.
    Porsche 944 Turbo Build

    One ride and you'll understand why most rocket scientists are German.

    My ZHP Build 2004-2014 RIP


  9. #39
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    The Windy City
    Posts
    9,155
    If thats true then how does this intake consistently make 10hp on a dyno?
    Call me Seth
    CURRENT: 2016 Long Beach Blue BMW /// M2
    RETIRED: ‘15 F22 M235i | '08 E90 M3 DCT "GoinHAM3" | '04 E46 M3 6MT "WEGOHAM"
    '04 330i ZHP | '11 E82 135i | '08 E90 328xi | 07 E91 328xi SportWagon

    Quote Originally Posted by danewilson77 View Post
    If I wore panties, I'd be dropping them right now.

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Liberty Township, OH
    Posts
    37,982
    I dunno Seth. You really believe all the dyno numbers that get put out? If you do.....my AFE puts out 20 HP, and 27 ft-lbs of torque.

    http://afepower.com/shop/details_new...0L&&brandID=52

    Even the BMW Performance intake (which seems to be a favorite), only consistently dyno's a 6 HP gain.
    Call Me Dane l 2/2004 330i ZHP l 18x8 ET45 BBS CK's wrapped with Michelin Pilot Sport AS3+ @ 245-40-18 l KW V1 Coilovers in front l KW V1 springs w/ Bilstein B8 dampeners in rear l BMW Performance Rotors l UUC StrutBarbarian l Racing Dynamics Rear Strut Bar l Jim Conforti Shark Injector l Light Birch Interior Trim l Bimmian Celly Mount l M3 Trunk Mat l l e90 Performance E-Brake & Shift Knob l M3 Tri-Stitched Boots l AL Headlight Retrofit with ZKW Lenses l CobyWheel Wrap w/M3 Stitching l LCM sw 4.5 triple blink and rear fogs l Maple Interior Trim

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